Survey Says: Trans people not attracted to Trans people

December 31, 2012

sexual orientation 70 M2T , 30 F2T respondants milt diamond

Source: http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/biblio/articles/2010to2014/2012-surviving-gender-variant-childhood.html

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24 Responses to “Survey Says: Trans people not attracted to Trans people”

  1. Marie-France Lesage Says:

    Well, that’s fascinating but not surprising, somehow.

    It just reinforces for me that sex is about biology, not about social (fake, artificial, man-made) “gender identities”.

    As a bisexual woman, I’m sexually turned on by faces and eye contact, personalities and trust, hands and mouths, scents and tastes, vulvas and breasts, penises and asses, not by “roles” or “masks”.

    Give me a natural, real, naked human being over mascara or a tux or heels or leather or latex any day of the week. As a person who has never developed a sexual fetish (which to me is about transferring natural sexual urges to something artificial) then why would I want to be in a sexual relationship with a walking collection of stereotypes?

    It’s like the difference between eating REAL food or trying to eat those plastic replicas of food that you see sometimes in restaurant windows. I mean…yuck.

    • GallusMag Says:

      “which to me is about transferring natural sexual urges to something artificial”

      That’s interesting because I’ve recently seen trans use the term “naturalist” in leu of “cis” for those of us who don’t use cosmetic medicine or surgery to superficially disguise our sex. As in “Naturalist women” or “Naturalist men”.

      • Marie-France Lesage Says:

        Well that is VERY fascinating, GM. Thanks for pointing it out to me.

        Huh.

        It’s almost as if some part of them is starting to get it. Maybe we’re getting through to some of them?

        Or is that too much to hope?!?

    • Ave Says:

      “Give me a natural, real, naked human being over mascara or a tux or heels or leather or latex any day of the week. ”
      amen to that i feel the same way!


    • “It just reinforces for me that sex is about biology, not about social (fake, artificial, man-made) “gender identities”.”

      Exactly! I absolutely agree with you.

      “It’s like the difference between eating REAL food or trying to eat those plastic replicas of food that you see sometimes in restaurant windows. I mean…yuck.”

      Again, I couldn’t agree more! :D

  2. Ave Says:

    This survey confirms how I thought it was, despite some transes saying i was wrong.
    I find it curious and amusing ftm was at complete 0 though; perhaps this survey was just with mtfs anwering the questions.
    it goes to show people also have a fear of “androgyny”

  3. GallusMag Says:

    “it goes to show people also have a fear of “androgyny”
    At least trans people- only trans people were surveyed.

  4. LJ Says:

    I’m waiting for someone to decide this survey is “transphobic” for splitting up the women into females and MtFs… This has clearly missed the official line that they are inseparable and indistinguishable. If you say you like women then excluding MtFs from your bed is a hate crime, last I heard??

    Ah wait it’s about what trans people find attractive! My mistake. They get a pass on all their preferences, whatever they may be. It’s only those “cis” people who need to reevaluate their sexualities in the light of other people’s gender ambitions.

    Anecdotally, I have heard of lots of MtFs say they are not interested in other MtFs. This is usually framed as: I wouldn’t want to have to be with someone who had hated their sex or gender etc like I have (of course the cis person they date has to deal with theirs, but cis people are meant to bear this), rather than pointing out the elephant in the room as to whether there are fairly fundamental differences between females and MtFs (particularly now many MtFs are non-op and likely to stay that way), which everyone – cis and trans alike – really does know are there. There are increasingly few places on the internet that a person is allowed to say that though!

  5. Chazz Says:

    I guess next year’s conference in Toronto will be: The Cotton Ceiling – R- Us.

  6. Beth Says:

    What do the “4” and “6” mean?
    Also, no takers for FtT’s and only 1% for MtT’s….interesting.
    But it’s expected that lesbian women will be attracted to them even when they don’t even find themselves attractive? Huh?

    • Lysandra Says:

      I had to go to the article to figure it out too. It appears the 6 and the 4 are allowing for some preference to be expressed, even if one is bisexual. So a 6 would be “bisexual with preference for females” and a 4 would be “bisexual with preference for males.” I don’t know why they don’t just say that on the chart.

  7. michelle Says:

    wonder how long before one of them comes along to mansplain how the study was twansphobic to basically point out that *shock* they themselves are apparently “phobic” and that they should be more enamored of the laydee-stick LOL!

  8. sylvie Says:

    Makes sense. I imagine some of it has to do with the ability to reconcile their own cognitive dissonance. Perhaps why androgyny is also unattractive, possibly how it might create doubt (in the eyes of others as well) and/or serve as a reminder of their own status.

    “They stated that there is not enough information explaining that, “gender is not a sexual thing”, and that “gender is not sex and is not a binary phenomenon””

    Yet it would seem from the survey results it is? Or is it that when you’re trans, expression isn’t but attraction is? “You can be a man without a penis” but neither M2T or F2T will consider you attractive?

    “Having to “live up to stereotypes” and being forced to “live within the gender binary” were phrases used in describing the causes of distress”

    How is that (and most of the responses in the survey) any different to most other people? I wish someone would tell me, so that perhaps things like the privilege checklist and trans victim mentality might become less repugnant. As far as I can tell, it always seems to be everyone else’s fault: “everyone else (being hung up about my gender) made me worse”.

  9. Violet Irene Says:

    Of course this makes perfect sense. They know, deep down, in a place where their delusions and fetishes and whatever else can’t reach, that they are inauthentic. But they desperately NEED to be authentic. And the only way to feel that way is to be desired by someone who is whole and real. A REAL lesbian, a REAL gay man, a REAL hetero man or woman. Not another trans person who is simply playing along with their delusion to preserve one of their own.

    • sylvie Says:

      “they are inauthentic”

      Exactly. Caveats, logic fails, loopholes, double standards…

      hypocrisy – definition of hypocrisy by the Free Online Dictionary …
      http://www.thefreedictionary.com/hypocrisyhy·poc·ri·sy (h -p k r -s ). n. pl. hy·poc·ri·sies. 1. The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness.

      “Hypocrisy often involves the deception of others and thus can be considered a kind of lie.”

      I find it interesting (though not surprising) that to not be “bullied, harassed, blamed, shamed or attacked” ranks so low (twelfth) on the “Needs of gender variant children”:

      “‘What do you think would have helped you as a child then?’ and ‘What do you think would help gender variant children today?’
      #12. To be protected—not bullied, harassed, blamed, shamed or attacked.”

      I realise it’s ranked in order of preference or importance. However I personally would have thought something like that would rank higher in the needs list, considering:

      – The incidence of it (indicated by the amount of comments and how many times that particular card is played – not just in the survey, but in general); AND
      – The prolonged/detrimental effects on quality of life, i.e. “I will never get over that” (a comment re having “endured beatings” at school).

      Would one necessarily need “to be offered help by professionals” (#5), if it weren’t for being “bullied, harassed, blamed, shamed or attacked”?

      Also:
      “To… have access to, transgender role models” (#10) ranks higher than “meet other similar children” (#13).
      Yet:
      “To know that others also have similar feelings and that gender variance is a natural occurrence” ranks fourth.

  10. oopster74 Says:

    You have to look at this survey from the point of view of the people being asked. If you’re a transwoman, no matter how others see you, chances are, you see yourself as female, and transmen as men. so to say you’re attracted to women, includes transwomen, and to say you’re attracted to men, includes transmen.

  11. Ann o Nymus Says:

    This actually is surprising to me. From having seen a lot of the community I know that a lot of the older autogynephilic “transsexuals” often do find the younger homosexual transsexual attractive. Unwelcome advances or sexual innuendo from the AGP’s toward HS’s is not that uncommon at all.. It’s One of the reason I as a rule detest the AGP’s and won’t spend any time in the same room with one. I obviously don’t think this study have any validity at all.. Not in western societies anyway.


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