June 14, 2012

Not what we usually hear from a trans blogger

27 Responses to “”

  1. BadDyke Says:

    What is a TERF? Do I really want to know? I think I might be one……………

  2. radicalwoman Says:

    That is pretty rare. Of course, all their trans friends are going to go in and talk about how they are caving to the evil “TERFS” or whatever name they are giving us these days for daring to talk about simple biological reality.
    I read the hate mail linked to in the other thread. It was rude, yes, but that’s the worst example of radfem hate mail they could think of to highlight? When I had a Certain Former Blog and made one, count it, one post where I mentioned trans issues and agreed with every single issue except one for one on which I disagreed and only asked for cooperation and understanding on that point, I got hate mail and rape/death threats and my name smeared across the internet for all eternity. It wasn’t even a blog about trans issues. It was just a basic feminist blog.
    But congratulations, vast majority of trans activists! You accomplished something very important by piling onto me in such a way for having stepped out of line – you ensured that I will never, ever be on your side again by revealing your movement as being comprised of utterly hate-filled, misogynistic bullies.
    For the few sane people like the one who wrote this post, I just feel bad for you. Your movement has irrevocably slipped over into the dark side.

    • RoseVerbena Says:

      Yep, it’s pretty much toxic as a movement. The inmates have definitely taken over the asylum.

      • radicalwoman Says:

        The sad thing is that I do know trans who, like the ones being pointed out in the OP, who are disturbed by this and other such antics. when they speak up, they are called collaborators, “self hating trans”, accused of having “internalized oppression”, etc., until they are shouted down. So they aren’t talking. Any trans who wants to just quietly live their life, as we are told they want to do, better have nothing to do with the movement that is supposedly supporting their right to do just that.
        When I thought trans rights were about being free to dress as they wanted and still be able to find an apartment and get a job, I was all for it. But suddenly it seems it’s about being able to tell women what to do and how to think. Maybe I just missed the real point the first time I encountered it as well.

      • Kathrin Says:

        I can’t tell if there was any other possibility, given the politics involved. The “movement” (such as it were) lends itself well to those who are inclined to colonize, to infiltrate, to destroy safe spaces.

        “When I thought trans rights were about being free to dress as they wanted and still be able to find an apartment and get a job, I was all for it. But suddenly it seems it’s about being able to tell women what to do and how to think.”

        Like many things in life, men like to bury the signal in the noise. It’s a very effective tactic, and patriarchy (as usual) takes advantages of opportunities to reinforce it’s own position.

  3. KT Says:

    I’d like to speak up, too, as generally I like your site a lot. I’m trans and IS (I mean actually IS, which has become a thing of embarrassment thanks to the likes of Brain etc) and disgusted by so much that is being said in the ‘community’ (with whom I have never had a positive relationship) lately that I feel a sense of personal shame about it. I don’t wish to be associated with it on any level. Ditto the ‘cotton ceiling’ idiocy – WTF is this sexual orientation fascism/entitlement supposed to achieve?!

    Not all of us believe in ‘gender identity’, not all of us believe these ‘medical’ treatments achieve magical results (my pragamtic take on the surgery was: my genitalia was deeply unhealthy & ill-formed before – and surgically mucked around with to boot – and a possible long-term health risk – so it was the lesser of two evils), not all of us want to intrude upon the space of others, not all of us were brainwashed with male privilege BS. Just, it seems, most of us, or most of the more vocal ones at any rate.

    Even though a lot of posts on here contain huge generalisations and caricatures, I can’t take it personally. It seems perfectly understandable. I’d never dream of trying to demand entry into a space I’m not wanted – and I pass so I could just ‘stealth’ my way in if I wanted to, but I don’t and why the hell would I want to? I have a sense of ethics and respect. I’m not a FAAB. End of. I may be 46XX and have a mostly female skeleton but what of it? I don’t share a FAAB’s experience, broadly, at least as a child and youth, and can’t ever share the biological issues specific to being a normal female. It isn’t rocket science. The vocal trans community has decided to prove that trans = batshit crazy, I’m sure, and tbh I’m starting to think that’s largely true, esp with the snowballing of these fake disabilities etc. It makes me question myself more extensively. They are making me feel shitty about my own existence. If any of you are kinda feeling that way about some of this stuff, it’s one thing I can totally understand albeit for different reasons. It’s scary and vile.

    I have probably met about 100 M2Fs (or M2Ts) over a lot of years and I’d say there were only maybe 3-4 of them who I didn’t feel were pretty much completely male, post-op or otherwise. Many of them were emrbarrassingly male and completely unable to even put on a semi-convincing act to the contrary – still engaged in the same pissing contests (“I had my first orgasm ten days after surgery!” – real quote BTW) (personally I could just about walk @ ten days) and bizarre male-conditioned crap as much as any Alpha I’ve ever encountered. The ‘gender’ conception was almost always superficial and male-conditioned in the extreme. This was obvious to me on first encounter with people in the community about 15 years ago. And it’s much more obviously worse today.

    Excuse the rambling. I just believe you have some important things to say and you might appreciate atypical voices from this direction – I don’t normally comment publicly on this stuff at all. Women’s issues will always be WAY more important and significant than a few trannies throwing their toys out of the pram and somehow getting disproportionate attention for it… which makes my head hurt, so this place is a haven of sanity pretty much!


    • DaveSquirrel Says:

      I’m trans and IS (I mean actually IS, which has become a thing of embarrassment thanks to the likes of Brain etc)

      But if you are genuinely intersex, then you cannot be tranz. Whatever (bad) surgery you had done was to fix a congenital condition, not for jendah games. Tranz don’t have anything wrong with their bodies, they have normal bodily development and seek out mutilating surgeries. They hijack the intersex case for public sympathy.

      So sorry your surgery was disappointing.

    • Thanks KT. Very much appreciated x

    • RoseVerbena Says:

      Thanks for your interesting post, KT.

      I for one draw a bright line between people who are actually, literally intersex and those M2T who (for example) live from birth to 30+ with 100% male socialization, entitlement and privilege (including playing on male sports teams as a child and youth, college, fraternities, dating and heterosexual marriage, procreation, career, etc.) and then suddenly decide that they have “always been a girl inside” and try to force themselves on women as a “real woman” who self-identifies as “better” at being a woman than natural-born females.

      People with an actual intersex condition are dealing with medical, physiological and psychological (coping, adapting, accepting) issues from birth or early childhood and are in no way the same as people who just volunteer for a transition due to a narcissistic, obsessive mental disorder aggravated by both the sexist socialization of patriarchal cultures and the current, faddish enabling being pushed by medical/psychological “gender” mills.

      Any person who can stand up and say, “Yes, I’m living as a woman but I know that I’m not really a woman. How can we work and live side-by-side in peace?” is OK by me. I never used to have a problem with M2T. But as soon as “trans women” whacktivists started doing things like trying to force themselves on women’s rape crisis centers as staff counselors, trying to invade MichFest, trying to get people FIRED from their jobs for seeing, remarking upon and acting upon the fact that M2T are in reality males in drag trying to enter female-only spaces? Yeah, that’s when my tolerance got burned up in a puff of smoke.

      You are intersex. They are not. It’s pretty much that simple.

    • GallusMag Says:

      @Dave of course people with differences and/or disorders of sexual development can transgenderize. In fact they do at a higher rate that non-intersex people.

      • DaveSquirrel Says:

        Rose explained it very clearly, there is a vast difference between someone who is intersex and has had to cope with the changes (or lack of), stigma, and even later correctional surgery – this is not ‘transgender’ – it is coping/fixing a legitimate condition, even if that surgery takes place in adulthood (as it should do, when they fully understand the implications of surgery).

        Transgender, in the true sense, is someone without any physical or hormonal condition, basically normal, who decides to ‘transition’ to mimic the opposite sex to play a gender role.

        Worlds apart.

        Intersex persons do need to realise the calibre and reputations of trans, and know that the trans agenda is very much co-opting their legitimate medical condition.

      • I agree with Dave that there is absolutely no overlap at all between trans and intersex, anymoreso than there is between males and females.
        If you were intersex then you would not need to call yourself trans. You would just quietly switch to your preferred gender, end of.

      • GallusMag Says:

        I beg to differ. Being born with a congenital disorder or difference in reproductive anatomy does not render a man or woman unable to transgenderize. A father of five who discovers he has some anomalous reproductive tissue when he gets an ultrasound for his kidney stones does not then become less of a transgender when he decides to undergo cosmetic medical and surgical treatments to approximate the superficial appearance of a member of the opposite sex.


        Having a DSD doesn’t make someone a sex-less blank slate. Having a delayed puberty or a micropenis doesn’t render one “sexless”. And even if it did, cosmetic treatments wouldn’t change it. Being born with a reproductive disorder does however make one statistically more likely to embrace transgenderism than the general public.

      • RoseVerbena Says:

        GM: I was thinking more of people like Nicky or the OP on this thread who say, “I am intersex” not “I had an intersex condition, I had genital-correcting surgery, and now I am REALLY a woman due to my surgery.”

        To me the difference is in the fact of the intersex condition being forced on them through no choice of their own and the respectful honesty that says, “Yeah I had surgery to cope with this but I would never pretend to appropriate the experiences or reality of natural-born womankind. I will never have a period. I will never get pregnant, or give birth, or lactate, or raise an infant born of my body. I will never have to worry about getting impregnated via rape. I will never have to worry about an abortion not being available to me. I just chose this surgery (or it was chosen for me by my parents) to make it easier for me to cope with everyday life as an intersex person in a gender-obsessed world.”

        I think, “What would my father have done if I’d been born intersex?” and I know absolutely that he would have given the go-ahead for as many surgeries as necessary to make me “right” with the patriarchal world-view on sex.

        I hope in the future that intersex people can live their lives unmolested and accepted as intersex people with no thought to changing themselves. Why should they?

  4. audaxille Says:

    KT, I’ve been thinking about my response to your comment for at least at couple of hours now but all I really want to say is ‘thank you’. Yours is a refreshingly human perspective and I, for one, didn’t read it as “rambling”. So, *thank you* 🙂

  5. magicpoppy Says:

    Don’t know if you’ve seen this:


    Cindy Bullens is transitioning. Her name is familiar to me, but I’ve never heard her music.

    • feral opera company Says:

      I’ve never heard of Cindy Bullens, but her article is well worth reading. She states that she always felt like a boy and wished she’d wake up in the right body. Later, as a mother,

      “As soon as my daughter Reid was of age, and I felt it was appropriate, I revealed my story to her. She didn’t flinch. She had, since puberty, railed at me and questioned why she didn’t have a normal mother who could show her how to put on makeup, who she could share jewelry with, and who wouldn’t just sit in the man chair at Victoria’s Secret while she shopped.”

      This is the typical pattern in so many of these transgender coming out stories. They just say they felt like a boy, but don’t explain what a boy is. Then, they talk about failing to conform to ridiculous femme stereotypes, as if that explained anything. If anything, Cindy was more socialized than me. If I had a daughter, I wouldn’t even let her shop at Victoria’s Secret, and I would have no idea how to help her put on makeup…I’d just wonder where I went wrong. Where is the transgender FAAB who can explain to me in plain English, why they are not really a woman?

  6. Lisa McDonald Says:

    You can add beyond brother getting my Radfem sister to understand. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGMESM8JKOg

  7. KT Says:

    I appreciate that. I’m inspired to start a blog (link on name, I guess), to vent some of my frustrations without stomping around on someone else’s space… I may change my mind & chicken out, because although I am basically anon here it still invites a lot of potential abuse. But some things need to be said. You’re an easy target in saying it, you know – it works both ways, it’s so easy for one ‘side’ to dismiss another. And even some dissenting trans voices, such as linked above, still have a mediated and somewhat political agenda underlying, to my mind. To explain that, it’s still a sense of ‘us’. I don’t think there is an ‘us’. So-called Transsexualism is a symptom incorrectly pathologised as a condition which puts a faux blanket over everyone who can be said to broadly conform to it, i.e. all people who modified their sexual traits in some way (or simply changed their wardrobe, it seems, these days). There are no transexuals in truth. Just a lot of people with wildly divergent issues and motivations, most of which are transparently of a psychological nature. Some of this stuff depresses me intensely. Particularly the increasing abuse of impressionable children – something that should be a jailable offence in my opinion, and in an ideal world there’d be an explosion of high-profile lawsuits about this a decade or two from now…

    • RoseVerbena Says:

      I’d say go ahead and carve those predictions of lawsuits in stone.

      Plenty of kids OUTGROW any childhood “gender” issues completely. Others come out as gay or lesbian or bisexual and recognize their early “gender confusion” as early signs of emerging non-heterosexuality.

      The long-term health repercussions of the puberty blockers and the estrogen/testosterone “therapy” are going to get UGLY.

      People are going to have major regrets. Many already do.

  8. mishmich Says:

    I support this article, as voiced in the comments section (Michelle May 30, 2012).

  9. KT Says:

    Yeah, I have to go with Gallus. I am a kind of tranny. Because if I had an intuitive feeling that the gonads were doing me harm (they WERE), tbh a basic removal of them would be a perfectly acceptable response – and they should’ve been taken out to begin with. And I did consider that. I still wonder sometimes. For better or worse I went for some kind of conformity after a fashion – also an aesthetic preference and a desire to try sex even if I haven’t done it much. (And it wasn’t very good, either!) But at least I don’t believe having done so makes me a Real Female or whatever. That’s obviously the biggest objection a lot of RFs have with trans people and I understand that totally.

  10. RoseVerbena Says:

    The hate and death-wishes being heaped on Cathy Brennan at Dyke March and later on-line just reinforces how out-of-control the crazy, fringe-most “trans” whacktivists have become.

    Someone needs to crack down on these death-wishers as they seem to become more bold every passing day that they’re allowed to act this way on-line without repercussion.

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