Williams College awards Bicentennial Medal to Dr Norman P. Spack: medical proponent of Eugenics and Sterilization of Gay and Sex-role Noncompliant Children

September 13, 2012

Dr Spack pioneered the practice of medically halting puberty in healthy children with off-label use of medications which prevent puberty and reproductive maturation. This “treatment” is followed by application of cosmetic cross-sex hormone regimes, which sterilize the children and render them drug-dependent for life. Since the children are below the age of legal consent, Dr Spack performs these irreversible procedures on the minors at the consent of the children’s parents.

The transcribed excerpt  below begins at 12:00.

From Doctor Spack’s acceptance speech:

“My remaining transitions came from a desire to do something innovative and take some risks. I was a pediatrician, but I was so involved in tertiary care I was really not suited to be a “Well Baby” doctor. I enjoyed the confidential dialogues with adolescents, particularly on matters of sex. So I immediately bailed out of General Pediatrics and did a fellowship in Adolescent Medicine. There I began to treat some transgender young adults, and feel badly that no one had gotten to them earlier, before they were already formed in a body that they found alien. I retrained in endocrinology in 1992 so I could become board certified with the support of my chief Joe Majzoub who is here, the Chief of Pediatric Endocrinology at Children’s [Hospital Boston]. I was fifty years old at the time I retrained and probably the oldest fellow in the history of Children’s Hospital. But it was fascinating because my former students had now leaped over me and become my mentors. And that’s the way medicine really is transmitted. That same year, 1992, I’m fifty, Ruth’s not as old as I am. Ruth, my wife who had run the English second language composition program at Tufts, decided to begin a Phd program. That led to her being offered a tenure-track position leading to a full professorship of English at Bentley University. That year our son John was in high school. Our daughter Rebecca was in college.

What were they thinking as they watched Ruth and me who seemed content in our professional lives seek to make some changes? Well maybe it’s had an impact on them and in a brief, not necessary digression I want to tell you what they ended up doing . And I want to point those who are here, I want them to see – Rebecca couldn’t be here because Rebecca the oldest is a social worker by training and a guidance counselor for the upper half students in a K to 8 school in Brookline Massachusetts from where she graduated high school. Her husband Arthur took advantage of the co-op programs that Northeastern Law School had to offer. He was noticed to have particular talent in the courtroom and he was fairly soon thereafter hired as an assistant district attorney for Norfolk County. Moving up to the superior court as the only male on a five person sex-crime domestic violence unit. He now is running his own law firm dealing exclusively in family law.  Our son… John? Are you here? I want them to see you because I think people may have questions for you. And his wife, Hagar, both of them immediately after college went into non-profit education work.  John initially in after-school programming with Citizen Schools, then Hagar in a couple incarnations but was working for Jump Start. And, it can work folks. They both got Masters: interesting Masters. John got a Masters, a new Masters given by Penn in Non-profit NGO Leadership. One year, two semesters, no thesis. Hagar… John is now the COO of a significant non-profit that does mentorship programs, started in San Francisco and he’s taking it national. Hagar, who was working for Summer Search has been made the chief executive of the Bay area Summer Search program. Summer Search takes kids who are at risk at high school, mentors them, supports them all the way through. And in the Bay area they not only have- what is it? – 91% college graduation rate. COLLEGE graduation rate. And it’s in seven cities around the country. She got an interesting Masters in Education at Stanford in Educational Policy. Two semesters, one year, no thesis.  So. There they are, they’re gonna be around, a bit, but you know, a lot…in a down economy sometimes non-profit work not only is available, because it’s privately supported, but provides incredible training, because one gets to do so many things. Around people who are excited about making a difference in the lives of others. So.

Personal transitions are like wooden Russian dolls. Open the outermost, and there’s another within. It’s equally shiny, often different, and hopefully pleasing to the eye. My transgender patients are transitioning into their affirmed gender. And my former trainees are now opening new dolls. As they inaugurate new programs for transgender youth in now- in the last three years: eight cities in the US have opened programs modeled after ours. Yes, including New York City and San Francisco. And finally: this Bicentennial Award experience has given me a chance to reflect on events that occurred at a pivotal time in my life. And in the life of this college. Indeed, I experienced transitions here that shaped my future year by year and in the process I was being transformed. Yard by yard.”

Dr. Norman Spack (photo credit: Boston Globe)


49 Responses to “Williams College awards Bicentennial Medal to Dr Norman P. Spack: medical proponent of Eugenics and Sterilization of Gay and Sex-role Noncompliant Children”

  1. GallusMag Says:

    Q&A with Norman Spack (2008)
    A doctor helps children change their gender

    By Pagan Kennedy
    March 30, 2008
    CHILDREN HAVE CUT themselves. In some cases, 9- or 10-year-old kids have staged suicide attempts. The little boys sob unless they’re allowed to wear dresses. The girls want to be called Luke, Ted, or James.

    Their parents, desperate to know what is wrong, go online and type “gender disorder.”

    And what they find is that, even now, decades after doctors performed the first sex changes in America, there’s little help for transgender children.

    Even the care of transgender adults remains a medical backwater in the United States; in fact, we do not even know how many people in this country have gone through sex changes, because doctors simply did not bother to keep track of patients. Until recently, children with cross-gender feelings rarely received modern medical care – and certainly not hormone shots. After all, who would allow a child to redesign his or her body?

    But in the past few years, some doctors have come to believe that kids should be allowed to have some control over how they grow up. Dr. Norman Spack, 64, argues that transgender kids tend to be much happier – and less likely to harm themselves – when they’re able to live in their preferred gender role.

    Last year, the pediatric endocrinologist started a new clinic at Children’s Hospital Boston; it is one of a few in the world to give children treatments that change their bodies. Working on a model borrowed from Dutch researchers, Spack uses drugs to delay the first stirrings of youngsters’ puberty, granting them a few more years before they develop bodies that are decidedly male or female. The effects of these puberty-blocking drugs are reversible; that is, patients can later change their minds. Unfortunately, this is not the case with hormones. Therefore, Spack prescribes estrogen and testosterone to only a few teenagers – after months of consultation with the patient, his or her caregivers, and psychiatrists. When kids take this step, they are rewriting their own future: The hormones have a powerful, pervasive effect, changing their height, breast development, and the pitch of their voices.

    IDEAS: When are children old enough to declare what gender they will be?

    SPACK: All I know is that when I see preadolescents, they have been dressing in the underwear of the other sex for years. These kids are almost certainly transgendered. They’re a unique population of patients. By the time a kid comes in to see me, both parents have agreed that the child is in danger and needs some form of intervention. And that has led to heavy-duty counseling for the child and parents. Therefore I see young people and families who have been evaluated by skilled professionals.

    IDEAS: At what age do you give kids drugs to delay puberty?

    SPACK: The puberty-blocking drugs work best at the beginning of the pubital process, typically age 10 to 12 for a girl and 12 to 14 for a boy. Stopping puberty is, in itself, a diagnostic test. If a girl starts to experience breast budding and feels like cutting herself, then she’s probably transgendered. If she feels immediate relief on the [puberty-blocking] drugs, that confirms the diagnosis.

    IDEAS: So the aim of your treatment is to protect children from harming themselves?

    SPACK: Transgendered kids have a high level of suicide attempts. Of the patients who have fled England to see me, three out of the four have made very serious suicide attempts. And I’ve never seen any patient make [an attempt] after they’ve started hormonal treatment.

    IDEAS: At what age should children be allowed to take hormones, like estrogen and testosterone, that will forever change the way their bodies develop?

    SPACK: Well, the Dutch would say 16. But I think more flexible guidelines will be coming out. For some kids, 16 might be appropriate. For others {hellip} you lose opportunities if you wait. [One of my patients, a] transgendered girl from the UK, was destined to be a 6-foot-4 male. With treatment, she’s going to end up 5-foot-10.

    IDEAS: What are the most difficult ethical issues you face?

    SPACK: The biggest challenge is the issue of fertility. When young people halt their puberty before their bodies have developed, and then take cross-hormones for a few years, they’ll probably be infertile. You have to explain to the patients that if they go ahead, they may not be able to have children. When you’re talking to a 12-year-old, that’s a heavy-duty conversation. Does a kid that age really think about fertility? But if you don’t start treatment, they will always have trouble fitting in. And my patients always remind me that what’s most important to them is their identity.

    IDEAS: Several years ago, you became an evangelist for transgender kids at Children’s Hospital. How did you become so committed to this issue?

    SPACK: Well, let’s start with 1974: I’m working at Bridge Over Troubled Waters as a volunteer. I see lots of transgendered kids. They were runaways, in bad shape. Then years later, in 1985, I’m working in adolescent medicine. Someone sends me a transgendered Harvard graduate who presented himself as a male. He introduced me to his friends and support groups. And then I began working with transgendered people in their 20s. The people in their 20s were socially in good shape. But they were having trouble getting their physique to conform to their identity. I knew the twenty-somethings could have better chances of passing if they were treated earlier.

    IDEAS: And how did you make the case for this specialized clinic at Children’s Hospital?

    SPACK: In the last five years, I’ve been getting more and more referrals, parents with gender-variant kids. The parents heard about me through Internet support groups. So, I began to bring my transgendered patients and their parents – kids as young as 9 – to a large number of clinical conferences in various departments at Children’s Hospital. That way, my colleagues could learn about this population. My philosophy is, “Who am I to say what it’s like to be transgendered when I have people who are living with it every day?” These kids won over the hospital, one department at a time.

    IDEAS: You’re involved with a number of Jewish philanthropic groups. How does your faith inform your work with gender-variant children?

    SPACK: My own rabbi said it best: The transgendered are also created b’tzelem Elohim, in the image of God.


  2. radishe Says:

    “I enjoyed the confidential dialogues with adolescents, particularly on matters of sex.”

    So full of ick.

    • radishe Says:

      Also, “All I know is that when I see preadolescents, they have been dressing in the underwear of the other sex for years. These kids are almost certainly transgendered.”

      I used to prefer my brother’s underwear as a child. It was cotton and comfortable, unlike the scratchy ruffly nylon things I had to wear. I’m 46 years old now, and didn’t realize I was almost certainly transgendered until now. wtf?

      Sorry if I don’t post quotes properly . . .

      • Adrian Says:

        SRSLY. Hell, I’ve been wearing men’s “tighty-whities” underwear exclusively for my entire life (42 here), yet somehow I’m not trans*. Go figure.

        Cotton and comfortable pretty much sums it up!

        I have to wonder too just where he gets the idea that non-trans* regular ol’ girls wouldn’t ever have problems with impending puberty. I know I certainly did, because all of a sudden it was all about “becoming a woman” meaning “you’re a sex object now! Also you can’t do X Y and Z anymore because it’s not ladylike, and hey, welcome to these uncomfortable clothes and being patronized even more than usual.”

        Delay that? Heck, where can I sign up? I was loathe to start wearing a bra in high school, because again, all about the sexual thing.

        Liberation (at least as far as possible) for me did not lie in trying to become a man, but rather realizing that I could be myself and still be a woman, just a non-conforming woman. Somehow I managed to grow up and yet not do various of the “but you must do this now” crap I was told I’d need to do or be rejected by the world.

        I realize though that I’m very lucky to have found the niche I did, and would like others to find it.

        The problem (for me) was “breasts” meaning a whole lot of other unnecessary baggage. Ditch the baggage, keep the breasts! That’s the fight we need.

      • weirdward Says:

        I was the same. Terrified of developing breasts because I knew it would be the onset of the sex object treatment, hated wearing bras – boys at school snapped bra straps, made fun of girls who had breasts that were too big or too small, made fun of girls who didn’t wear bras, real good times.

        Then when my periods started they were horrible – very inconsistent, so I never knew when one was coming, and I tended to bleed heavily for days one end, sometimes for over a week. I would have given ANYTHING to stop them.

        It’s just ridiculous to suggest that any girl who is not 100% down with her own dehumanisation into femininity must be trans. No girl wants this crap, I guess some of us are just more self-aware or have better chances to resist.

      • doublevez Says:

        So mortified at 11, to have to wear a bra which in those days looked like the nose cones of a jet engine. I hugged the wall everywhere, so no-one could see the straps; lived through ridicule, bra-snapping, daily attempts at cop a feel, sickening gestures and terrible shame. I’ve hated my breasts all my life. I could not bear to breast feed it made me sick to my stomach because of years and years of shame. I think if I had known about the concept of cutting, I’d have done it. If I wasn’t shamed and threatened *for* them, I was hated *because* of them. I had to quit sports it was so humiliating to be laughed at and hear the things boys *and* men said openly, with pride, when they bounced. Then, at 17 I entered a beauty pageant, or was entered, it seemed like that’s what one did, and was told, they were too big so, points off total score.

        This man? It’s not “ick” I feel reading him, it’s sick.

    • michelle Says:

      seems like another component of psychology might refer to that as the grooming of an adolescent by a sex offender…

      concur that the comments are ‘so full of ick’ -I could also say that Spack is full of something else, but I will try to be polite 🙂

  3. What a narcissist, blathering on and on and on about himself, his wife, his son’s wife, his age when he retrained, his this, his that.

    “If a girl starts to experience breast budding and feels like cutting herself, then she’s probably transgendered.”

    Or there’s the possibility, of course, that she probably isn’t. That she’s probably suffering from being sensitive enough to realise she lives in a woman-hating society….

    • Adrian Says:

      Exactly. You hit puberty, and people start looking at you differently, and that includes a giant helping of creepy, because, well, patriarchy. Suddenly you’re a sex object.

      Amazingly enough, some people don’t take to that right away, y’know? How can this guy not realize that?

      • Of course men project their sexual fantasies onto us, and they assume that WE are as turned on by male slavering as they like to THINK we are — but of course we’re not.

        Most of us (all of us?) found puberty to be terrifying and disgusting because of the enormous increase in UNWANTED male attention and all the body symptoms: breast tenderness and nipple irritation/pain, menstrual cramps and diarrhea from the prostaglandins, bone aches during growth spurts, destabilized emotions due to hormones, painful and embarrassing acne outbreaks including painful cystic acne, etc. There’s nothing quite like being (essentially) a child with a child’s mind and emotions (playing with dolls, playing children’s games with family and friends, still in the 6th grade, etc.) and being targeted by disgusting, slavering, terrifying older men with a rape mentality just because your painful, awkward chest started to “betray” you by bursting into breasts.

        They’re all “Oh, you just love it when men want you” and we’re thinking, “Nope, nope, nope…in fact, HELL NO.” Creepy doesn’t even come close.

  4. And this:
    “The transgendered are also created b’tzelem Elohim, in the image of God.”

    God is male, so he’s only talking about M2Fs here.

  5. weirdward Says:

    I think he’s basically got the award for finally figuring out how to ‘cure’ lesbian and gay kids. I mean, the medical profession is in a bit of a quandary, what with conversion therapy now being frowned upon and in some places even being illegal. But here there’s this great new way to get rid of those butch girls and feminine boys all done under the transgender rights umbrella which is supported by both the mainstream feminist and gay rights movements.

    The boys must just be slapping each other on the backs at their own genius with this one.

  6. wildwomyn Says:

    Why isn’t this labeled child abuse? Committed by parents and doctors?

    What happened to “First do no harm?”

  7. lush Says:

    “before they were already formed in a body that they found alien”

    What is it about their bodies that they find alien? An absent X or Y chromosome? Fallopian tubes, a prostate? The recto-uterine pouch (or lack of one)? The things that can actually be fiddled with thanks to modern medicine and are made necessary to fiddle with thanks to gender stereotypes: hormones, external sexual characteristics, hair length and distribution of it on the body, posture, voice? Is it that their body PHYSICALLY CRAVES to be touching the clothing that the culture it inhabits designates for one side of the binary or the other (nature is, duh, naked)? Is it that their bodies twitch, recoil, start to ache whenever labeled with the meaningless pronoun that does not match their mind’s conception of which side of the gender binary* their culture would assign them to based on arbitrary characteristics?

    I can believe in suffering from a split between mind and body, though it’s not something I’ve ever personally experienced. But I don’t see this as an inevitable, naturally occurring phenom, the spirit rejecting the body. Healthy body parts are born “right;” there’s no reason to believe that a functioning body is in need of repair. Transgenderism as an ideology forcibly separates the body from the mind, widening the dysphoria between one’s ultimately meaningless born sex and harmfully meaningless assigned gender instead of trying to close it. Instead of changing perceptions (a hell of a lot easier, cheaper, safer, biophilic, uncapitalistic, and all-around better for human beings) of both the individual’s body and of our society — basically, making the minds fit the bodies — people are encouraged to make their bodies fit their minds. It’s fucking crazy! Instead of fortifying their minds, people are told to carve away at their bodies to become as close as possible to an impossible, arbitrary, socially-ill ideal; it’s a process that’ll run from birth to death. Huh, sounds a lot like something else us feminists are obsessed with…

    So this dude with an unbelievably conservative and unscientific viewpoint (“Gender is real! And it’s manifested by underwear!”) is lauded as a progressive hero for facilitating the mutilation and discombobulation of young people, stretching minds even farther away from bodies. It’s darkly comic, and I can only retain my sanity by hoping this is a short-lived medical fad, and two hundred years from now people will laugh at our ridiculous attempts to retain a useless, dying system by chopping people up.

    Damn, this was long, and full of things genderskeptics already know…but I was on a roll!

    *or, for the “genderqueer” or whatever, mixtures of aspects from the binary that supposedly constitute a “spectrum,” nevermind that as far as I know, a spectrum still runs from the middle in two opposite directions that presumably never meet, suggesting an ultimate system of binary genders. Way to rebel against the existing system, dudes!

  8. SheilaG Says:

    The “enjoyed” comment was a big ick for me too.
    I can’t believe this guy!!! Do we really want these guys anywhere near adolescents?

  9. Ave Says:

    Trans is a deception but sometimes i can’t help but think sometimes there is practicality in it…

    • anon Says:

      there’s also a practicality in the prison industrial complex, using patriarchal religion to reform drug addicts, trying to force marriage as a cure for poverty, etc.

      That doesn’t make it right or even a plausible solution.

  10. doublevez Says:

    Oh the joy in the halls of academe. Renewed funding for our endo labs.

  11. background spinner Says:

    Did anyone else get a James Marion Sims vibe? (“father of gynecology” and the “architect of the vagina”–whatever that means) Entitled, self-important quackery and the willing to experiment on the powerless, to the point of seeming obsession.

    http://www.whale.to/a/brinker.html Father Butcher by Wendy Brinker


    Sims should have been tried for what he did, but was/is honored. I wonder what this man’s fate will be.

    I absolutely agree that he shouldn’t be allowed near children.

    • GallusMag Says:

      Oh my. Interesting.
      I also found it interesting that while the Children’s Hospital of Boston Chief of Pediatric Endocrinology made the trip and Spack’s son presumably flew in from San Francisco, Spack’s daughter and her partner- who live and work a stone’s throw from the ceremony- were “unable” to attend.

      • cabochon Says:

        Was this endocrinologist the same one that just got arrested for child pornography?? (See Gawker or Jezebel…)

      • GallusMag Says:

        HOLY SHIT! This just happened yesterday?!?!?!?!
        Dr. Keller is Spack’s co-worker, in the same department at Boston Children’s Hospital:

        Children’s Hospital doc arrested on child porn charge

        By Herald Staff
        Thursday, September 13, 2012 – Updated 1 day ago
        E-mail Print (66) Comments Text size Share
        A pediatric endocrinologist was charged today in federal court with receipt of child pornography, the U.S. Attorney’s office is reporting.

        Dr. Richard J. Keller, 56, of Andover, was arrested and charged today with receipt of child pornography.

        Prosecutors said Keller bought or ordered more than 50 DVDs of child pornography online. An ongoing search of his home in Andover has turned up more than 500 high-gloss photographs and between 60 and 100 DVDs of child pornography, authorities said.

        Keller is a pediatric endocrinologist at Boston Children’s Hospital and a pediatrics instructor at Harvard Medical School, according to U.S. Attorney Carmen Ortiz’s office. He was also medical director at Phillips Academy for 19 years before he stepped down last year.

        According to a postal inspector’s affidavit, the case began with an investigation two years ago of an unidentified overseas movie production company that offered streaming video and DVDs of films featuring nude young boys engaged in food fights, showering, wrestling in bed and playing Twister. A review of records of sales in the company’s database led to Keller, the affidavit stated. The inspector said films were delivered to his home, a post office box and to a medical office at Phillips Academy. Some of those DVDs were recovered in the search of his home today, the postal inspector said.

        In federal court today, Judge Jennifer Boal ordered Keller, who pleaded not guilty to the charges, held until a Monday detention hearing.

        Prosecutor Michael Yoon said the government plans to show that Keller“appeared to have a dedicated sexual interest in children, going back several decades. Based on those factors, we do believe the defendant is a danger to the community.”

        Keller appeared in court in a green tee-shirt and khaki. He kept his head down as the judge, then the prosecutor detailed the charges against him, but as he was leaving court, he mouthed the words “I love you” to a woman sitting in the court.

        The women refused to identify herself and said she had no comment for the press. Keller’s court-appointed attorney Page Kelley declined to comment.

        A Children’s Hospital spokesman said in a statement: “Providing safe and appropriate care in a safe and protective environment is the absolute paramount priority for Boston Children’s Hospital. When the hospital learned of the allegations against Dr. Richard Keller earlier today, he was immediately put on administrative leave pending results of the investigation by the US Attorney’s Office. We will cooperate fully with the US Attorney’s Office and all other involved regulatory and legal authorities. No complaints or concerns have been expressed by any patients or family members about the care Dr. Keller provided while he was at Children’s.”

        A statement from Phillips Academy noted Keller is not a current employee and said: “The safety and well-being of our students is our top priority. We are fully assisting the U.S. Attorney’s Office to ensure that investigators have the information they need in order to perform their duties as it relates to this case. To this end, we are seeking all available information as it pertains to this matter, and will be regularly briefing the Andover community as we learn more in the hours and days to come.”

        A Harvard Medical School statement said only, “Richard Keller, MD, has held an appointment as a part-time faculty member at Children’s Hospital Boston in the Department of Pediatrics since 1992. He holds the part-time title of clinical instructor at Harvard Medical School.”

        If convicted, Keller faces a mandatory minimum of five years and up to 20 years in prison, lifetime parole and a $250,000 fine.

        The U.S. Attorney’s office encouraged people with information or concerns related to the case to call 617-748-3274, saying messages left at the number will be promptly returned.

        Developing …


      • GallusMag Says:

        THANK you for the tip.

      • michelle Says:

        Keller’s arrest brings my earlier grooming comment back into play…and again raises big red flags about what these doctors are doing in the name of ‘medicine’ or ‘science.’

      • So it turns out that this guy is indeed pure narcissist with a god complex. An evil narcissistic kiddie porn viewer who clearly gets off on talking about adolescent girls’ agony over their “budding breasts” which he can cure by advising that they chop their breasts off and take hormones which will sterilize them.

        Not surprised at all to find that when it comes to pro-trans doctors this is the type of person we are dealing with.

      • Oh I see, Keller is Spack’s co-worker, not actually the kiddie porn viewer himself.
        It still makes perfect sense that pro-trans doctors hold warped views on kids and it’s therefore not surprising that a man with a penchance for child porn has specialised in a field that concentrates on “budding” adolescent bodies (to use SPack’s turn of phrase)

      • hearthrising Says:

        I haven’t seen any news reports that this guy is involved with promoting drug treatments for so-called trans children, but he must be, since he’s a pediatric endocrinologist and works with that Spack guy. I wonder if the media hasn’t figured it out, or if they don’t believe it’s relevant.

  12. FCM Says:

    all my heroes are creepy pervs too. oh wait…


  13. doublevez Says:

    Hey Gallus you’re going to isolate this latest development into a story, right, so we can link it? Here and there… .

  14. Lock this monster up and throw away the key. Ditto for any other “medical professional” (ack!) engaging in this unethical behavior.


  15. “Cotton and comfortable pretty much sums it up!”

    Ditto! I wore men’s cotton briefs for years until I found a reliable source for comfortable cotton women’s briefs with a double-cotton panel and non-scratchy/non-irritating leg holes (covered with soft cotton bias-tape.)

    Women’s underwear is usually scratchy, not absorbent enough, made from too-thin or flimsy material and quite uncomfortable.

    I don’t have a transgender molecule in my being, either.

    Where do these idgets get their information?!?

    Oh yeah: they just make it up.

  16. Adrian Says:

    Something else, too – recently I found myself on the website “tumblr” and as it happens there are a LOT of F2T posters there, most of them very young, frequently still in college if not highschool. Just today I was reading a “transition blog” of a girl planning to transition to man, who is only just now going into “sophomore year” so… 16?

    It’s like turning up rocks to see what lurks beneath, I suppose, but I find myself reading some of those blogs.

    There’s been some discussion here of trans* as a way to erase homosexuality. However, what is interesting to me after bingeing on a bunch of these blogs is just how many of them are NOT that at all – so many of them are F2T (or “CAFAB” or “DFAB” or various acronyms, meaning female) and attracted to MALES, so now they say they’re not just trans* but also GAY. So they’re women, attracted to men, but now they’re trans*, so that MAKES them necessarily “gay” (not straight! No! Definitely not straight! They express hate for straight “cis” people on their blogs ALL the time even) and yet on top of all of THAT, they’re wanting to be “femme” gay men, so… they’re biologically female, they want to express stereotypically “femmy” gender markers, they want to have sex with males, and yet… somehow they’re supposedly men, so, they’re queer. Or something. It’s like going out of their way to be marginalized, it seems like. I mean, it’s 100% girl looking, girl dressing (more than I ever did!) people, who just insist no, you have to call me “he.”

    How are they not just straight women with a fetish for the gay male subculture? But they’re so so very young and still living at home and yet their parents and whoever else are paying for them to visit people like this Dr. Spack, and starting transition – although most of the posters are very early in the process if they’ve started it at all and quite frankly they don’t “pass” in a million years. Yet they are so terribly upset when gay men in gay bars brush them off or heaven forbid point out the obvious “you’re a girl, so no.” Just lolwut?

    Granted I’m not so well educated in it and given my own background admittedly a little (maybe more than a little…) hostile to people who think wow, I don’t want to be the stereotype of a girl so I MUST be a guy! so feel free to consider me a “hater” I guess but… they just all seem to fetishize a certain image of the “swishy” gay male culture to an extreme, how is that not appropriation??

    • Tumblr is an asylum made of glass so you can see right into the cells.

      More than once I saw gay men got attacked for not being attracted to these girls. They were called cissexist scum and so on. Don’t let me start to talk about the bullshit lesbians have to deal with.

      In order to not get called transphobic you have not only to agree with the ridiculous nonsense transgenders spew you also have to give up your sexual autonomy.

    • It is simultaneous self-hate in a patriarchal, woman-hating world (“being who I am feels…wrong”) and appropriation (“I know, I’ll become a gay male instead”.)

    • Noanodyne Says:

      Warren Beatty and Annette Benning’s daughter-on-T “Stephen” is the poster child (“poser” works, too) for the appropriation of gay male culture by a straight female.

      • Adrian Says:

        Heh. Yeah, in fact that was the blog that led to me to the others! That one in particular has quite a bit of the “sigh, I hate straight people” “I hate cis people” stuff in it, too. From there I found lists and lists of similar “I’m both gay and trans!” people wanting to be “femme bois” and the like. So many young women so obsessed with the ideal of male bonding portrayed in old boarding school movies and the rest.

        But more surfing around yesterday led me to other F2T blogs on tumblr where they’re trying to be overtly masculine, too (which would be candidates for the “I don’t want to be lesbian, now I’m a straight man” thing, I suppose) and some of those were just depressing also, to find out just HOW strict the gender segregation is being applied nowadays in some places. There are blogs over there (just look at the lists of people posting to “fuckyeahftms”) by people who are very early in transition, very young, absolutely feminine looking, but complaining that their parents are giving them trouble for such things as choosing boxy “male” T-shirts rather than the form-hugging “girl” T-shirts at concerts, or not shaving their legs or armpits. People angsting about how can they get a haircut at a barbershop?

        (Well, in my non-trans* experience, you just walk into the barbershop and ask for a cut, like anyone else!! But of course, the barber does refer to me as “she” as he happily buzzes my hair.)

        I just can’t help wondering how they’d feel if they were not getting such pressure.

  17. ktsimilar Says:

    Just more evidence of how fucked-up our culture really is and how the only solution is, and will be, some kind of huge explosion that will hopefully leave some sanity in its wake. It isn’t just the gender crap. The economy of every single ‘civilsed’ country is in irreparable ruins. The system is breaking down – it never quite worked and now it’s burning itself out. While The Man continues his repugnant attempts on all fronts, to Conserve the untenable disaster he’s made.

    Truth and sanity might well win out, y’know. Fuck Patriarchy. Or not. I think it’s fucking itself.

  18. i saw a comment from a parent on someone’s FB wall who’d just had surgery asking questions about hair removal, she said something along the lines of “i’ve been telling my 12yo son about the importance of hair removal, at the moment he’s happy wearing dresses but it’s good to be prepared”

    shitting fuck 😦

  19. Bev Jo Says:

    Thank you so much, Gallus, as always. It’s Dr. Purient Lecherous Money all over again. Should any male doctor ever be allowed around children?

    Meanwhile, so many eloquent statements here about why of course girls growing into puberty in a culture which not only hates females but is disgustingly leering and sexually harassing girls would make girls wish they did not have bodies which would make them vulnerable to male predation.

    You know how men re-write history to make all the Lesbians appear as compliant het women? Well, at the Butch Voices event last night, too many there were re-writing history to refer to Lesbians by male pronouns. It was horrifying to be in a room full of Lesbians and hardly hear the word Lesbian. I’m still trying to figure out if they are too embarrassed or ashamed to consider themselves Lesbians, while “queer,” trans, etc. are just so much more trendy and acceptable.

    A few hours earlier, at a completely unrelated event, I met a very feminine-appearing what seemed to be a young Lesbian and asked if she was. No, “he” identifies as a “boi” and uses male pronouns. Why does this feminine young woman want to identify with the group of people who rape, cause wars, torture and kill animals, and are destroying the earth, rather than identify as a woman or Lesbian? Is it self-hatred, female-hatred, or just wanting privilege? I later heard a man very respectfully referring to her as “he” — far more respectfully I thought than most men refer to young women or young Lesbians who are thirty or more years younger than them. I guess that explains it.

  20. mieprowan Says:

    I’m researching Spack online and found this. Much appreciated.

  21. Bart Wasserstein Says:

    You all know nothing about what you’re insulting. God forbid you might take the time to learn something, looking at the subject with an open mind, before opening your mouth.

    And the worst part? You all seem to be lesbians. You’d think that people who understand first-hand what it’s like to be hated, discriminated against, insulted and belittled would be more understanding, and at least tolerant. Apparently, this is not the case.

    • Ashland Avenue Says:

      We know waaaaaay more about this than you. Also, had you bothered to read more posts here, you’d see the very justifiable reasons why we’re angry.

      News flash: we’re not your mother. We’re not required to care for you, despite the fact that many of us here are women. And just because many of us here (though certainly not all) are lesbians, doesn’t mean we should put up with male bullshit simply because they put a dress on.

    • Noanodyne Says:

      Educate yourself, dude, before you presume to tell anyone else what they should know. It’s only your dudely sense that you simply must know more than women, because they ARE women, while bothering yourself not at all to find out whom you’re addressing.

      Here, this addresses your arrogance simply and directly, very little reading needed (I can see it’s difficult for you):

  22. […] a single trans website, blogger, or journalist has reported on, commented on, or re-posted the “Dollmaker” Dr. Norman Spack’s recent TED talk. It is, as they say, “problematic”. He is completely […]

    • RadicalGrandma Says:

      “Creating” transgender children? That is grooming, and sick.

      So tired of the stupidity and ignorance masquerading as “education” and “science”. But money! for the win for those who advocate it. Always follow the greed.

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