Toronto Dyke March says female bodies belong to everyone

June 27, 2015

201 Responses to “Toronto Dyke March says female bodies belong to everyone”

  1. Bev Jo Says:

    Male hatred of Dykes is endless and men posing as Lesbians are the worst. But they would harm far less Lesbians if Lesbians stopped betraying Lesbians for these men.

    In SF, there is a break-off group from the Dyke March today who seem well-meaning, but the first logo I saw they used is from a past march banner saying “Love for Trans and Queer People of Color.” Last night was the trans march. We know most are quite privileged men, so this seems an appropriation of Lesbians and gay men of Color.

    Tomorrow is the huge corporate gay parade with endless trans representation, though most are het men.

    Why do Lesbians support these het men in destroying the meaning of the Dyke March? We know why….. our bodies belong to them.

    • KgSch Says:

      Thank you! My question to all the sell-out lesbians is: are you fucking happy? Are you happy knowing that heterosexual men basically run the dyke marches and make creepy, rapey statements on the internet and in person? Are you happy that there is no lesbian-only space and that Big Trans* Inc (so called LGBT+) made it their mission to use money that lesbians and other women gave them to destroy one of the last big female-only spaces, Michfest? Are you happy you must walk on eggshells to make sure you don’t offend your tranny “friend” because if you do “she” will send a mob after you?

      Trying to get men to change and treat women better rarely works, especially not for these men who build their entire identity on not being able to take no for an answer. Lesbians and other women can change though and even if they don’t care about their own mistreatment, they might eventually care about the way other women are being treated. The more women know what a threat this cult is, the better.

  2. “female bodies belong to everyone who i.d.’s as a woman – that is dyke march policy and not up for debate”


    This breaks my heart. I feel like I’m in a horror movie.

    I’m on a dating site, and three MTTs “winked” at me just today. One even had a photo that included stitches on his neck…he obviously had his Adam’s apple smoothed.

    They don’t say that they are bio male, which I find deceptive and rapey.

    • Lint Says:

      Gross. And it is completely deceptive and rapey but that’s what trans are. Not surprised in the least that they would attempt to trick a lesbian in to fucking a man. They have zero morals and total contempt for the feelings of others– women in particular.

    • KgSch Says:

      Ew gross. Does the website you are using allow you to report spam or harassment? If you are only looking for women to date, then you can report het men who harass you with their rapey bs.

      Lying about your biological sex to have sex with someone is rape by deception.

      I was thinking about joining online dating, but I might want to go for a smaller site with good harassment reporting policies. I don’t want to deal with autogynephile creeps. I live in a smaller (less than 100,000) city where the main economy is old people retiring here and the university. The university has the “queer-straight” alliance which is always about everything trans. I value my sanity too much to go near it. The university also has the pimp-funded slut walks. Yeah, it’s that kind of school. The opinion section of the university newspaper, which for some reason takes up most of the newspaper, is basically cut-and-paste rhetoric from tumblr SJWs.

      The city I live in is about a 30 minute drive from a much bigger city, so maybe I should try to meet women there.

      • kesher Says:

        There was a dustup a few weeks ago because trans men were getting kicked off of Grindr due to gay men flagging their accounts, which is just so damn hilarious. Of course gay men aren’t going to tolerate that. It’s probably even more frustrating for them since trans men aren’t as easily clocked as trans women, especially transbians who are so often hideous.

        As far as dating sites go, I doubt you’d be able to find a lesbian-friendly one that’s willing to police transbians calling themselves “lesbians” and infesting the W4W section.

      • GallusMag Says:

        I saw the funniest goddamn NEWS story this week. What happened was that a female transgender who believed herself to be male went to use the male restroom ON THE SECOND FLOOR IN MACY’s- lolololol. Now, as any member of the “LGBT” (and probably most men) know, upper level male department store restrooms are NOTORIOUS toe-tapping, glory-hole, get your closeted-ass dick sucked while your wife is shopping, cruising areas. DOESN’T EVERYONE KNOW THAT. Well apparently this woman didn’t. So she goes in and plops her ass down on the seat in the stall and is sitting there, giving out all of the “signals”- and she gets a bite: some dick-crazed homo takes a peek. At this point she neither unlatches the door to let him in nor does she say “fuck off man” or something. So the cock-sucker is confused. Eventually he sticks his whole damn head over the partition so they can get a better look at each other. And she’s A WOMANNNN! Hahahahahahaha! No dick for you sir! LOLOLOLOL. So the man-lover is shocked and irate! “You’re not a man! This is the mennnnnnnnnnnnn’s room!” Well the woman apparently has no idea what is happening so she tells our hapless homo “But I AM a man! You are harassing me!” “No you are NOT and this is my favorite cruising spot!” he says- or something. LOLOLOL. So the woman argues with him a while, then she leaves to report him to security: not for cruising her but for discriminating against her as a woman who doesn’t know what cruising is. Hahaha. What can the store do? Not much. So she GOES TO THE PRESS! lolololol. There was a whole article about it. Funniest thing I’ve ever read.

      • Annoyed Bi Chick Says:

        “Invictus Animus”?!?! You’ve got to be fucking kidding me. Okay, so she’s 23, but cripes, I was more grown up than that at 23. It’s like okay now to legally change your name to your World of Warcraft character handle? Wowee…

      • Susan Nunes Says:

        I can’t get past the name of the trans person in the article: Invictus Animus.

      • GallusMag Says:

        Mah name is Invictus Animus and I’m a woman whose mission is to expose the rampant homosexuality occurring in certain known male public cruising spaces. I’m like a super hero! Call the press! LOL.

        Dear, dear women who call themselves by their RPG or SCA names and want to use male facilities although female: FYI

        -Certain male restrooms and other places are “known cruising spaces” where men of the actual male variety meet for no strings attached “quickies” during the course of their regular activities.

        -These places are usually characterized by their isolated features, or by their location in travel areas.

        -Popular locations include: Upper level restrooms in department stores and universities or other public places. Airport, bus station, subway, rail station and truck stop restrooms. Public parks and highway pull-offs.

        -A very good indication that you are in such a place is that a male individual will enter a stall and sit silently for a very long time, perhaps even tapping his toes impatiently on the floor.

        -Another good clue is that after you have been sitting in a stall for some time is if a dude will step up and eyeball you through the gap in the walls of the stall. He is looking to see if you are playing with your dick, which is a signal to him that you would like a homosexual encounter.

        -If you would NOT like a homosexual encounter, (or are not actually male) and you are in such a space and approached in such a way, simple etiquette is to clearly state “OCCUPIED!”. This indicates that you are not a male looking for a homosexual encounter, but are instead having a public bowel evacuation (or whatever).

        -In short, if you are going to use opposite sex restrooms because you believe yourself to possess a reproductive system other than the one you actually have, you might want to familiarize yourself with the cultural norms associated with restroom usage of the sex you claim to affiliate with.

      • morag99 Says:

        Regarding her name: yeah, she was really reaching for the trans stars with that one, eh? But with that name, she could’ve proclaimed: ” I am Invictus Animus, and I banish thee, O Evil Peeper, from the men’s room!”

        Instead, she told the “hapless homo” (ha — you are bad, Gallus!) that he was being “inappropriate” and weakly protested something like, “B-b-but I AM a man. Like, hello? Brylcreem? And I’m wearing a tie and everything … ”

        Personally, I find it hard not to feel pity for the sheer naiveté of this rather mild-mannered young woman. And for the very worrying sense of entitlement that one can just become any fictional character she desires to be, and that she’ll be recognized by others as that character, despite her immutable characteristics and personal limitations. I mean, the cruising dude didn’t see any grand and elegant “Animus” sitting in the toilet stall; he saw her Anima (snort!) — and he saw it straight away.

        At the heart of the younger gender-trenders there seems to be a socially-produced developmental delay, where the inability to fully distinguish between fantasy and reality is carrying on through adulthood. Male trans-activist propaganda successfully exploits these young people with developmental problems to its own ends.

      • Loup-loup garou Says:

        Here’s a bathroom story: about a year ago, I walked into the women’s room at a popular lunch place in my extremely liberal city, and right there in the disabled stall — with the door wide open — was a 40-something dad helping a two-year-old use the toilet. (Btw, I really did not get the impression anything other than was going on.) This person was definitely a man — Adam’s apple, Tom Selleck mustache, wide shoulders, and so on.

        He glared at me and said, “This is the WOMEN’S room.” I was at a loss for words, so I just said, “Right — and I’m here because I’m a woman, and is the correct restroom for me, which it is not for you.” He looked mildly startled but didn’t leave. I think he was under the impression that he could be in there if he was with his daughter or needed to use the diaper-changing table (although I am fairly sure most mens’ rooms have these now, too). Legally, he had the right to take a child of either sex under the age of two into the men’s room, but not the women’s. But instead, there he was, telling an actual woman to get out of the ladies’.

        I should probably have spoken to the restaurant management. However, I didn’t want to deal with a possible (probable) barrage of vile comments from the guy. It also seemed likely that the restaurant staff would not have the slightest idea what to do, or any inclination to get into the middle of this. (I base this on what usually happens in busy restaurants around here when a crazy person walks in and starts going from table to table harassing customers and asking for money — nothing.) So I used other the stall and got out. Not an ideal solution, but I just wasn’t in the mood for a loud, semi-public altercation with the potential to get very ugly, very fast.

        At no point did I consider contacting the network news.

      • AreUSayingWhatUThink Says:

        She is so obviously a woman.

      • kesher Says:

        That’s the new frontier for trans politics. If a trans “man” acts like a submissive doormat, the way women are socialized to behave, then that’s “male” behavior.

        It’s very convenient for FTTs who don’t want to/can’t change their behavior to be more stereotypically masculine; they can adopt whatever identity they wish and don’t have to feel bad for “acting like” women. It’s an even better deal for MTTs who can continue to act like shitty, violent men while claiming that as “female behavior”.

      • gaydude50 Says:

        Dear Gallus,

        Basement restrooms are also usually very cruisy.

        ~ a man

      • GallusMag Says:

        Ha! Thank you- Can’t believe I left that out! 🙂 Listen to the gay man, Invicutus Animus Idiotus and company!

      • gunhild Says:

        Yeah wow that name, used as a real name. Invictus Animus = “Unconquered male spirit”?

      • river Says:

        Men have no compunctions about leaving their spoor wherever they thnk women will be. Loup loup’s comment reminded me I hadn’t told you about my most recent experience. At a very popular bistro I entered the “everyone” washroom and while closing the door noticed a weird yellowish glare on the back of the door. Some male had pissed all over it leaving urine streaks running down from the loops arcs he had made, It was then I realized the door handle, and my hand, were wet.

        Thanks legislators, assholes in drag, and all the various letters in the alphabet save the “L”.

      • KgSch Says:


        You are probably right, so maybe I’ll find a free site/free trial site to join. Lesbians should take a leaf from the gay men and flag the accounts of these scammers (good job gay men on Grindr and good for you for having some pride and self-respect.)


        Well, I learned way more about what goes on in isolated men’s restrooms than I ever wanted to know, but that story did make me laugh, especially the girl’s name. Thanks GallusMag! And I thought I had a crazy name.

        Moragg99 is right about the socially delayed development. Sorry if this is stereotyping, but go to an anime or comic con convention. Most people who go to these things as a hobby, including me, have lives and jobs outside the convention, but there are always some people who take it too seriously, and you will find a lot of trans trenders among that group. The number of them has increased a lot in just three years at the same convention too. (I am friends with a lesbian in the UK who said that she likes the conventions, but has been increasingly annoyed by being unable to escape the trans bs during what should be a fun weekend.)

        River has a good point. You know how males of other mammal species mark their territory by peeing everywhere? A lot of human males do the exact same thing, even when public toilets are readily available or when you live in a nice house with indoor plumbing (see my brother when he was 13 and decided he had to be in the yard). Or in this case, when the toilet was right fucking there and he decided to pee on the door instead.

        Early feminists in the United Kingdom campaigned for sex-segregated public toilets because that would enable women to participate in public life in (relative) safety. This is actually something that women in parts of India are currently campaigning for. Ironically, thanks to Big Trans Inc, women in first world countries who have had sex-segregate public bathrooms for a while are losing that right. All in the name of being progressive, “queering the bathrooms” and not being a bigot.

      • Leo Says:

        Sorry if this is also stereotyping, obviously this doesn’t always apply, but I wonder if, rather than it simply being immaturity, the possible autism connection would account for any higher percentage of transpeople at anime conventions or other ‘geeky’ events? Of course not all autistic people gravitate towards ‘geeky’ types of special interests, but it can still be the case for some. Especially with what you say about the ones who take it too seriously tending to be the ones who are trans, KgSch.

        I actually had no idea cruising was that prevalent so am obviously as naive as that young woman, lol, maybe it’s not as much so in the UK, I don’t know, although certainly the public parks still applies.

      • KgSch Says:


        That’s a good point. A lot of the younger transtrenders have other issues such as autism and mental illness. Like with anorexia, I don’t see how cosmetic surgery and so-called puberty blockers would help. (Those drugs are really chemotherapy agents and adults usually can’t take them for more than six months.)

        There is also a popular trend of self-diagnosing yourself with mental illness or a developmental disorder on sites like tumblr or reddit. I don’t mean in a logical fashion like, “I have these symptoms, and so I did research and think I may have this and I will talk to a professional about it.” The attitude is, “I definitely have this disorder, and suggesting I get that self-diagnoses confirmed by a doctor or other specialist is ableist and classist, you abuser.” You see, poor people can’t afford get medical care so that means that it’s classist to suggest going to a doctor or shrink, even if you’re lower middle-class and/or still on your parent’s health insurance like a lot of these people are. The ableist line is because words mean whatever you want them to and the “because I say so” narcissist trend. Not all the people doing this are trans-trenders, but there is some overlap. I think there are parallels between fetishizing mental illnesses and developmental disorders (or thinking having one of those things makes you unique and special) and the trans trend.

  3. Lint Says:

    “that is Dyke March policy and and not up for debate”


    What a bunch of disgusting, bratty, foot stomping children with these definitive declarations that ban debate, discussion, or dissent.

    And the whole phrasing of “female bodies belong to to anyone who ids as a woman” is so creepy and possessive I assume that it had to be written by a male.

    • morag99 Says:

      ‘And the whole phrasing of “female bodies belong to anyone who ids as a woman” is so creepy and possessive I assume that it had to be written by a male.’

      Yes, it’s creepy. Just horrid phrasing. But, I do believe in Freudian slips, and this is a good example. Men identifying as women is, quite simply, an expression of ownership over female bodies. They subsume us.

      • mochi Says:

        Are you sure it was a Freudian slip? I mean, isn’t that when you accidentally say what you mean? How do we know that wording was an accident? Me, I’m not so sure…. creeeeeeepy.


  4. kesher Says:

    What do the tweets say? I can’t really make them out.

    • stop the madness Says:

      Click on the original link, it’s much clearer.

      How much more of this are we expected to take? I think the only thing to do now is start our own groups again and stand strong against the bleatings of “twanzphobia.” Let the trans be “lesbians” by themselves!

    • LC Says:

      You can if you go to the original source and enlarge the pic.

      • kesher Says:

        Thanks to both of you. I originally went to the OP, but I guess I didn’t think to click on the screenshot there.

        Interesting, but not surprising, how claiming the “identity” of woman is no longer good enough. They have to claim our bodies too.

  5. RadicalGrandma Says:

    As usual, males appropriate our everything.

    There is no liberation in this and real dykes know it, so obviously that had to be written by a man.

    Goddamnit, we have to stop this intrusion into women’s spaces. I will never accept these pretenders.

  6. michelle Says:

    Interestingly enough, I never got an answer from them when I tweeted to inquire as to what would happen if I wore my “I am GallusMag” shirt…granted, I wasn’t in Toronto, but their tweets seem to suggest that THIS lesbian would NOT have been welcome at a dyke march…

    • GallusMag Says:

      Then I guess they really won’t like my “Men can’t be Lesbians. Sorry Bruce/Caitlyn” sign at all.

    • coelacanth Says:

      You would have been attacked physically and assaulted by mobs of trans, handmaidens, gay drag queens and hetero-bi-pan-ally queers. And if you survived the beating and tried to press charges, you and not them would have been charged under the law with hate crimes; taken before the human rights commission (Gestapo) and fined massive amounts of money, made to recant and be publicly humiliated and shamed in the mainstream media (tv and print) and your name would be forever on the internet as a hate criminal. You would never work again, your family would be stalked, your life would be ruined.

      THIS is Canada. THIS Is the new trans state which only exists because it is embedded in the Orwellian madness of PC left “human rights” apparatus right out of the Khmer Rouge that now terrorizes the populace under the guise of “diversity”.

      The mayor of Toronto explained to the media at the pride week flag ceremony (trans had a separate ceremony which Gallus documented last year when fights broke out between trans camps) that he the mayor had been schooled by two local trans (their names appear on this blog repeatedly) on how transgender was the most pressing social issue of LBGTQ and since he now had been edumacated by them so everybody else better do the same or those poor trans would all suicide and it would be our fault.

      Toronto has 5 (FIVE) trans parades: 1 a queer protest parade; 2 trans only, 1 “dyke” meaning trans, and 1 “gay” meaning trans. Five trans parades and the original gay men and lesbians who bled to make this possible have all been kicked to the curb if any of us so much as peeped No (most are dead or gone invisible, like me). If you want to really commit suicide in Toronto wear a terf t-shirt to the pride week and you will literally be torn to pieces by the mob.

      Happy Trans Pride!

      • GallusMag Says:

        My new sign simply says: “Autogynosmile!”

      • kesher Says:

        How has liberal Canada gone this crazy? Heretofore, I thought nothing could make Canadians rabid. Except for the pomo garbage, they sound like Americans.

      • KgSch Says:

        That’s awful, but I believe it. I remember when that pervert flashed his boner at an old woman in the locker room, the old woman got called a “bigot” by the head of the so-called Human Rights Commission for reporting him. I wonder if those homeless women who got raped by that guy impersonating a woman at the homeless shelter are also bigots.

        It’s complete insanity. The trans cult is worse than the right-wing religious fundies, because at least the right wing religious fundies are honest that they hate us and only very self-hating gays and lesbians fall for their crap. The trans cult is a parasite that pretends to be the friends of lesbians and gay men, and also is the most oppressed group ever that needs our help when in reality most of them are pervert het men who are always in a rapist mindset. The belief that men can become women, women can become men, and the “born in the wrong body” lines are essentially a religious belief and the belief gets imposed on everyone. It’s so weird that lesbians and gays who otherwise don’t believe the “you’re going to hell for being a homosexual” nonsense will believe that they are “oppressing” creepy het men and het women who claim to be the opposite sex.

        As for homosexual transitioners, the whole thing was invented as a procedure to heterosexualize lesbians and gays, so we really shouldn’t support it.

  7. mayimoktoo Says:

    I also try to give women the benefit of the doubt. We all make bad phrasing choices sometimes. (And that was a doozy!) but then they dug deeper instead of acknowledging what they had actually said. There was no follow up dialog, it was just “transwomen are women! That’s all.” Then again, it’s hard to expect much from an org that say “While lesbians are an important part of the Dyke March…” with a straight face.

    Way back in the early 90’s, I wanted to go to some Portland incarnation of Michfest/Pre Lilith Fair type show with some lesbians friends. They very nicely explained that some people were getting a little frustrated with activist straight women crashing their parties*. I was welcome but, you know, maybe not go? So I didn’t. I stayed home and it was fine. Because it’s NOT THAT HARD to stay away from places you aren’t wanted.

    * I don’t know if this was the true feeling at the time. I think it was but they may have just wanted to go together without a third wheel. Or without me, I was a rather annoying activist in my early 20’s.

  8. atranswidow Says:

    I’m not sure if this is the right place to post this link, but it seemed appropriate…….

  9. southwest88 Says:

    I am a het woman who has been called a dyke all my life due to my looks and lack of interest in having a man around all the time. I have had stuff thrown at me from moving pick-ups to yells of anti-gay slurs. I have been threatened with violence by men who decided that I was lesbian for “talking back” to them. None of these experiences gives me the right to think I know what lesbians feel and experience in life. Any man who claim to be not only a woman but a lesbian is full of BS. It would not even occur to me to demand to be included in a gathering or march for lesbians. Guess party-crashing and violating the boundaries of others is something that men, especially men who claim to be women, feel that they are entitled to do.

    • branjor Says:

      Boundary violating is THE male specialty. They’ve been doing it for thousands of years in thousands of ways, from forced heterosexuality to “consensual” heterosexuality to trans “lesbians”. I am literally at the point where I can’t distinguish “boundary violator” from “male”. To me, they’re one and the same.

      • Relieved Says:

        I got bothered by a MTF trans at a Pride event this weekend for the first time and got to see this weird boundary pushing behavior first hand. It really drove some of the things I’ve read here home.

        Two very large/tall obvious transwomen walked up while I was sitting by myself in the tent trying to get out of the heat. One unexpectedly put his big ugly man paw – with chipped nail polish and “man cuticles”- somebody call Caitlyn! – on my shoulder and made some snide remark about my clothes looking “bargain bin”. I pulled away while he continued to blather some self-absorbed, over-affected bullshit while I desperately stared blankly at the wall in hopes of boring him away. He quickly realized that I wasn’t going to play along and they left (thank dog!).

        Did I mention I hate being touched by strangers? Yeah, hate that shit. Hate it even more when it’s a middle-aged man dressed like my grandmother, pretending to “woman” by pawing me and insulting my clothing.

        I like it even less when it’s TWO men, both about 6 feet tall, leaning over me making the stupid ass-umption that “real women” get right up in each others faces and make catty remarks like some bad VH1 game show. I think they targeted me because I’m bi and I look a little butch with my head shaved. He wanted to make a point that I wasn’t being a good woman by not wearing frilly inappropriate dresses and a made a (very male socialized) status jab by passive-aggressively insinuating that my clothes were OMG! noticeably cheap.

        Oh the horror! Oh how do I live with myself as a woman with my bargain bin taste! I must go cry now that I am not a good woman because I can’t afford expensive ugly dresses like those big tranny men can! Boo hoo. (sarcasm off)

        They were obviously not drag artists or gay men. They were both big ol’ white men dressed like 1950s housewives that stank like men (yes, men don’t smell like women on a basic level) and they gave off nasty pervert vibes. After experiencing their bullshit first hand for the first time, many Mtf are obviously just boundary pushing males that use the “dress up act” to get away with things they would get in trouble for doing while acting and dressing male (touching strangers without permission/ bothering strangers).

        I don’t think they have much to do with gay people at all, and it’s becoming obvious that it’s time for the GLB to get a smaller umbrella.

    • Dorothy Mantooth Says:

      I’ve never been called a dyke, but I’ve been hit on/crushed on by a few lesbians (which is a COMPLETELY different experience from being hit on/crushed on by men, btw) and I agree: I’d never feel fully comfortable in a lesbian bar or lesbian space, any more than I would feel comfortable, as a married mother, attending one of those lunchtime speed-dating things. It’s not for me; the purpose of the gathering is to share things I do not share, or to meet people interested in activities I am not interested in. Just because I share a few of the characteristics of an oppressed group doesn’t mean I’m fully a member of that group, and it’s rude of me to push my way in and assume I belong there.

      This is INFURIATING. I am livid on your behalf.

      And I wish desperately that there was something I could do to help or make a difference. I hate that you have to fight this outrageous, ridiculous fight for spaces that should be yours by definition.

    • australopithecene Says:

      That’s weird, why is Buck backing off respectfully instead of violently threatening them and telling them they are killing her? Why aren’t they being told to die in a fire? Oh, that’s right, she’s a woman.

    • Newbie Says:

      A comment on that Buck Angel thread:

      “Colette Kase
      hmm not sure what they can be ‘hurt’ about. Perhaps misguided, ignorant or bigoted..but not hurt. You being you has nothing to do with loyalty to them. How on earth can someone be ‘loyal’ to a gender or sexuality. We are loyal to people – and that you are. You are an ally and a warrior for all lgbtqi people. Absolutely – you do not need to be in a space where you are not wanted, but it does worry me the young dykes who may be looking for a safe space and not finding one among these people who identify as dykes – but are as bigoted as other groups who exclude. I’m a queer dyke heterosexual woman married a to a trans man with a vagina myself. So you can imagine why I’m angry.”

      I feel like I’m taking crazy pills.
      When tortured, eye-crossing utterances like, “queer duke heterosexual woman married to a trans man with a vagina” become not just common parlance but mandated discourse my Orwellian Geiger counter starts banging the roof off.

    • Newbie Says:

      GM You can trim that thing as short as you want actually. I just wanted that poor brainwashed lesbian’s back-breaking capitulation accurately in context for you if you thought it was relevant.
      This place is such an eye opener for me. I feel like the scales have fallen off. Thank you.

      • Annoyed Bi Chick Says:

        Damn, but people will go to some amazing lengths to avoid the word “bisexual,” won’t they? The way I see it, is pretty soon, lesbians will once again (how 19th C.) be assumed to be “men in women’s bodies,” and bisexual people will be just “obviously trans*” somehow, because the “trans* umbrella” as they call it is coming for everybody. Which basically means that sooner or later it’ll mean nothing, and “What do you mean you don’t want to sleep with me? I’m trans*, you’re trans*, what’s the problem?”

    • K Says:


    • No name Says:

      This is a pretty regular thing with all transgroups/lesbian groups that belong, or cater to born-men in dresses. Buck Angel and other butch women that do go along with all this nonsense become compliant to the men’s new rules-they get the same treatment.

      The trans[mans] avocate calls these women all men, and pushes them to leave women’s spaces. They are not welcome in men’s places, and many of these women just want to peruse gay lives and don’t want to go to the gay community to be forced into the company of men- so they are pushed out from the gay community altogether.

      They are a joke to be sacrificed first- but kept around to be used as an example when needed, they are treated like third wheels by the men in dresses and never really welcome in men’s, trans or women’s groups.

      Buck Angel was being used as an example meme, remember when they were posting everywhere, ‘Would you send this man to a woman’s doctor?’

      How ironic and sad that Buck had to go see a ‘woman’s doctor’ and will need to see them as she gets older because, no matter how many steroids she ingested, she is a woman.

      I see this as another hole unwanted non conforming women are pushed into, to erase female culture and divide women in general.

      • Bev Jo Says:

        Don’t assume Buck is Butch. Real Butches aren’t even allowed to be shown in the mainstream or Lesbian media, while men posing as women are everywhere.

        Most women pretending to be men are posturing Fems, and many are het/bisexual women wanting sexual access to gay men.

      • No name Says:

        Yes, there is a big difference in Butch women that love what it is to be a women- they just reject the stereotypes, and the women that hate being women- want to be treated as men and see being a woman as a permanent 2nd class placement.

        Mostly, it is being reinforced by men that women can escape the caste system by chasing a false reality of becoming men. If anything placing the hope of escape of being treated as women and be treated as equals under a ‘little man-facade” is a distraction that keeps them from working with other women addressing the problem of men placing them in a caste system- that men maintain and created to control women.

      • GallusMag Says:

        Bev is saying that Buck was a feminine bisexual, not a butch dyke as you asserted. You are clearly not lesbian and know nothing about our culture.

      • No name Says:

        I agree, Buck is neither Butch or Lesbian.

      • No name Says:

        I am sorry if it sounded like that- but I said
        ‘Butch women that love what it is to be a women-‘
        ‘the women that hate being women- want to be treated as men’

        as two different groups, but I did not refer to Trans as butch and the same thing.

      • Oceans Says:

        If you want to walk out of the house of womanhood, then don’t expect to drop back by whenever you feel like it. You were too chickenshit to be a woman in a difficult world. You’ve bought into the toxic, crushing sexist BS stereotypes by trying to be a “dude.” Angel Buck can go fuck herself.

      • GallusMag Says:

        @No name- it was your statement “Buck Angel and other butch women that do go along with all this nonsense..” that I was taking issue with and calling out as tone deaf and ill-informed regarding lesbian culture. I’m going to move on from this now. Thank you for clarifying.

        @Oceans- I agree that Buck is very woman-hating and basically a female MRA. I can’t help but think her experience surviving horrific child sexual abuse may have had an impact on her sense of self. Seems a bit presumptuous of me I know, but I can’t help thinking it.

    • kesher Says:

      “Actual dykes” (aka dicks in dresses) kick the actual women-loving woman out.

    • Mortadella Says:

      Yeah, saw that episode of John Oliver. At one point, trans-activists were compared to suffragists.

      They showed a clip with Laverne Cox too. I kept thinking, “People really love to celebrate women…when they have a dick and balls.” They showed a clip of a tranny crying because the staff at his local DMV made him take off his wig and make-up before getting his driver ID photo. He wasn’t called too sensitive and hysterical, I can tell you. Must be because he was born with a dick and balls.
      A woman appropriating black culture was deemed ridiculous by the media, though. No dick, no balls equals no empathy.

      • Unperson Says:

        There’s a lot of 1960’s sexist comedy about ‘dumb broads’, or ‘take my wife….’ in that piece. Plus the tub thumping NWO demagogue rallying the faithful. ‘WE HAVE GOT TO GET THIS RIGHT!’ Someone needs to paint a Hitler moustache on him, he’s even got his own flag!

      • kesher Says:

        A woman who cried over something like that would be mocked relentlessly. Yet another entry in: no one thinks these guys are actually women.

    • Zemskull Says:

      Regarding the segment in which he mocks the media asking transgenders about the “bottom surgery”: isn’t this a logical question? I’ve seen famous born-women such as Melissa Etheridge who shared that they had breast cancer and interviewers asked them if they had lumpectomies or total mastectomies. And born-women such as Angelina Jolie who openly shared that she was at genetic risk for uterine and breast cancer, so she had both removed.

      If you go on a national television show to discuss undergoing a series of medical procedures that may include some involving genitals, don’t be surprised if the interviewer asks about them. And really, “bottom surgery” is a quite polite way of describing what happens.

      • morag99 Says:

        Zemskull, I was just thinking about this while listening to a man interview Buck Angel. He came on with a jocular I-don’t-know-nothing-about-this-far-out-transsexual-stuff, and it seemed that NO question was too far. He asked her about her genitals, about her sex life, about who she likes to fuck when she’s not doing porn. And she kept saying “wow, that’s a great question!” before spilling her guts in great detail.

        Now, from what I’ve gathered, Buck is famous misogynist, and by her own admission, a batterer of women (but that was before! Before she became her true male self and washed those sins away in the purifying blood of medical transition!) And yet, despite her masculine identification and values, her female socialization bubbles to the surface.

        The man asks, she answers. She takes a good attitude toward him. No shushing. No boundaries against his prurience and sexy, vaguely homophobic jokes about how hot she was when she was modelling fashionable women’s clothes “as a woman.”

        The rules, the etiquette guidelines, are different for girls, even when they are self-identified “men.” But this marked difference is just business as usual, aka, invisible.

      • kesher Says:

        They’re playing coy because they don’t want middle America to know how many of them are packing. Meanwhile, as long they’re demanding entry into women’s spaces, including spaces where nudity is common or expected, they better learn to deal with uncomfortable questions. Women have a warranted interest in whether we’ll be seeing peen in the women’s locker room.

      • Zemskull Says:

        Hi Kesher: I think you’re right about the coy bit. Before I began reading here, I assumed that the overwhelming majority of MTTs had bottom surgery. It turns out that as few as seven percent do. Even some of the most progressive Americans are going to have a difficult time accepting a penis-owner who claims to be female.

  10. Oak and Ash Says:

    Gallus Mag, I’m not sure if this is the right place for this comment. My apologies if it isn’t.

    Although a life-long marriage dissenter myself, I’m glad that people in same-sex relationships–some of whom I know and care about–will be able to have the legal rights that marriage has traditionally granted.

    That said, it’s disturbing to find myself in agreement with Justice Scalia’s disdain for the first line of the opinion. “The Constitution promises liberty to all within its reach, a liberty that includes certain specific rights that allow persons, within a lawful realm, to define and express their identity.”

    I’m concerned that the bit about people being allowed “to define and express their identity” could have serious legal consequences if extended to men who claim they’re women. It’s bad enough that autogynephiles are already flouncing around our restrooms and locker rooms, but what if we get to a point where any man can legally be a woman just because he says so in order to demand a female roommate in college, play on women’s sports teams, or count toward a company’s number of female employees? (“Listen, human resources needs a few more of you guys to identify as women to improve our hiring stats.”)

    If men and women were viewed as equal under the law, gay marriage would simply be an extension of that equality. (In fact, I remember that argument being used as a scare tactic back when the equal rights amendment was still a possibility.) In other words, if a man could marry a woman, it would be discriminatory not to allow a woman to marry a woman. Similarly, it would become illegal for schools, corporations, etc. to enforce gender-conformity. It looks to me as if all the separate laws and rulings for gay and transgender rights are designed to give men what they want–whether it’s to marry as they wish or invade our private spaces–while avoiding full equality for women.

    It’s telling that men weren’t stampeding into womanhood before the feminists of the first and second wave worked to make it a less miserable place to be, at least in western countries. Now that we can vote, have careers, and own property, they expect to move in and take over while hanging on to male privilege. If, supposedly, there have always been transwomen, where were they all back when women had fewer rights?

  11. @coelacanth

    It’s not quite as bad where I live, but almost as bad. Everything is queer and trans.

    “Toronto has 5 (FIVE) trans parades: 1 a queer protest parade; 2 trans only, 1 “dyke” meaning trans, and 1 “gay” meaning trans. Five trans parades and the original gay men and lesbians who bled to make this possible have all been kicked to the curb if any of us so much as peeped No (most are dead or gone invisible, like me). If you want to really commit suicide in Toronto wear a terf t-shirt to the pride week and you will literally be torn to pieces by the mob. ”

    It’s almost as bad where I live.

  12. In the spirit of truth in advertising, the name should be changed to reflect reality. It’s not complicated. Just change three letters in one word. Keep the words Toronto and March, but change the “yke” in Dyke to “ick” and it all makes sense.

    Toronto Dick March 2015….

    Dick March Trans* Town Hall

    “While our other Dyke March town halls are open to all members of the dyke community, we are hosting this trans*-specific event in response to the need for specific attention to the ideas and concerns of trans* people.””

    “All trans* dykes are welcome and encouraged to attend.

    Trans* dyke” refers to any person on the spectrum of gender identity who identifies with the label. We welcome dykes who identify as trans women, trans men, two spirit, third gender, intersex, genderqueer, genderfluid, non-binary, bigender, agender, and gender independent.

    The Toronto Dick March is, or was,seeking advice from “cisgender males”.

    Dick March Cisgender Men Survey….

    The Dyke March is an event that exists to celebrate, affirm, and empower dykes. As such, our policy since the March began in 1996 has been that all self-identified dykes are welcome to march, and that non-dyke allies are encouraged to support us from the sidelines.

    At the same time, cisgender men*, many of whom are our friends, allies, family members and partners, have sometimes also joined the Dyke March in support. However, we know from post-March surveys from the past several years that many dykes in our communities have been unhappy about the presence of cisgender men within the Dyke March.

    We are circulating this survey to learn about how our fellow dykes feel about this issue so that we can work towards a solution that will make everyone feel comfortable, safer, and supported on dyke day.”

    Speaking of Toronto, it’s the home of Christopher, “Jessica”, Hambrook. He likes woman and he sometimes identifies as a “woman” (at least long enough to sexually assault homeless women in women’s shelters). Therefore, he is an honorary “dyke” for a day. I imagine he is still in jail, but this is Canada, so who knows. For all we know, he could be in a women’s prison somewhere.

    Other marches around the country…

    SF Dick March,

    “We understand dyke identity to include those of us who are questioning and challenging gender constructs and the social definitions of women: transdyke, MTF, transfeminine, transmasculine, genderqueer, and gender fluid dykes…

    We continue to hold the Dyke March as dyke-only space. We invite our male allies to enjoy our Dolores Park rally with us, and to please support us from the sidelines during our march to Castro…”!dyke-identity/c1em0

    There is no such thing as “transdyke”. You are actively involved in colonizing lesbian and dyke identity. MTFs are males, and males aren’t “dykes” or lesbians. Genderqueer or queer identified females can be dykes, but not genderqueer males.

    MTFs do not “challenge gender constructs”. Instead, they are actively engaged in perpetuating sex stereotypes, destroying women’s spaces, occupying and colonizing every inch of lesbian space, and making TERF death threats, etc..

    This is the bay area, so I wonder if Dana McCallum marched alongside women?

    New York City Dyke March….Thanks for respecting dyke history…

    “All self-identified Dykes are welcome to march regardless of group or political affiliation.”

    At least they don’t insult the entire female sex by forcing women to believe that dykes (non-traditional women) have a penis, but they leave the definition up to the individual.

    Dykes are female.

    Dykes are female.

    • KgSch Says:

      Other than the obvious appropriation of lesbians/dykes, I see those wackjobs are once again appropriating people with intersex conditions. Intersex is NOT some sparkly special snowflake gender label; it’s a group of medical conditions that mean that there is something wrong with your sex chromosomes. Most of these conditions interfere with your life in a negative way and you can’t identify your way into having an intersex condition.

    • RadicalGrandma Says:

      The entire thing sounds as though it was written by a male.

      All men are welcome, but not women? Women should not indulge this bullshit. Ever. Just refuse to participate and let the public know this is not an event for woman-born dykes.

    • morag99 Says:

      Dick March — eww! And here’s a perverse new twist on an old song that’s been running through my mind while reading this thread:

      As we go marching, marching,
      We battle too, for men,
      For they are women’s children,
      And we mother them again …

      Could be an anthem for the “third wave.” I mean, what’s the use of feminism and/or lesbianism if it doesn’t nurture and liberate the dick, right? Priorities, ladies, priorities!

  13. Unperson Says:

    John Oliver promotes autogynephilia a bit too earnestly. You have to wonder if he has frilly panties under his suit

    • Mortadella Says:

      But don’t they all? I never realized how many men find crossdressing so alluring…up until two years ago. During the ’90s, I heard a comedian say he’s in favor of breast implants, then he paused and said, “Not for you ladies, for us men.” The audience laughed. I thought the joke was the idea of men really really liking breasts — so much so, they’d consider getting their own, was an satirical take on men’s willingness to objectify and fetishize certain body parts.
      Of course, at the time, I was a teenager.

  14. Zosha B Says:

    They should have just stopped it at “female bodies belong to everyone”, because let’s face it, that’s what they really mean.

  15. […] Toronto Dyke March says female bodies belong to everyone on GenderTrender […]

  16. MaryMacha Says:

    I no longer go to the Dyke March. I haven’t gone in years since the male presence has been a problem for some time. The whole situation feels helpless and hopeless. It has always been difficult to maintain women-only space but now it’s just being obliterated. We can thank the trans-allies for this. If these, mostly, women weren’t working so hard to shore up patriarchy we would still have some safe spaces for lesbians to socialize and organize in our own interest instead of for men. I went to the very first Dyke March in DC over 20 years ago. Before that we had Take Back the Night Marches. Maybe it’s time to recreate things from scratch.

    • KgSch Says:

      That might be a good idea. Have our own spaces again, and then we would be able to kick out pomo libfems who want to fawn over men who fetishize lesbians.

      They still have Take Back the Night Marches, but if you are a radical feminist who commits the terrible crime of teaching a woman’s self-defense class for women-only (not men pretending to be women) you will be kicked out.

      Most of us seem to be scattered across the US, Canada, and a few other countries, but some of us probably live close enough together to start groups.

  17. Secret Serval Says:

    Not even the Girl Scouts is just for actual girls anymore. Any parent who says their son is really a girl can participate.
    And they gave back a donation which would have helped disadvantaged girls because the donor asked it only went to girls, not boys who are presenting as girls.

    Just started reading Gender Hurts. It’s like a refreshing drink of sanity amongst my pomo transhandmaiden friends.

  18. lestoille Says:

    so how many lesbians inched closer towards Peak Trans when they saw this? it’s basically a slogan for the cotton ceiling. keep digging that grave for yourself, boys and handmaidens

    speaking of peak trans, im enjoying the current climate much more lately. thanks bruce and rachel! especially for your impeccable timing.

    a site i visit regularly has long had a blackout on the subject, it’s always been total capitulation or FUCK OFF TERF, no in-between. the cracks are starting to show now however. last week women discussed a troubling transgender issue (with very carefully chosen phrasing). The resident tranny showed up with his objections and crocodile tears, but by the time he started terf-shaming it was over and no one cared any more. it’s such a small thing, and yet I never, EVER expected to see that type of conversation happening there. this was a site i thought would hold out until the bitter end. it was like seeing those 600+ “terf” comments on the NYT article.

  19. @Secret Serval,

    “And they gave back a donation which would have helped disadvantaged girls because the donor asked it only went to girls, not boys..”

    Asking the Girl Scouts to actually put girls first is so transphobic and bigoted. It’s so not politically correct and yesterday. Shame on people for requesting that money go to girls not confused six year old boys with purple hair and trendier than thou, new age moms.

    “Not even the Girl Scouts is just for actual girls anymore. Any parent who says their son is really a girl can participate.”

    By their words and actions, the Girl Scouts are telling girls two things. First, they are lying by saying that males can be female, or change their sex. It’s a biological fact that no primate can change its sex. Please don’t bring up rare disorders of sexual development because the vast majority of transgender identified people have no actual intersex medical condition. This issue has been discussed at great length. These are biological males with perfectly healthy reproductive systems. Second, by forcing this p.c. insanity on girls, they are essentially telling girls that any and everything comes before their needs. The rights of boys comes before the interests of girls.

    I think the worst thing anyone to do to a girl is to lie to her, and groom and condition her into accepting any man in a dress into her private spaces such as restrooms, locker rooms, etc. This and other blogs have numerous examples of cross dressing men committing crimes in women’s restrooms and locker rooms or exposing “her male genitalia” (Colleen Francis). All it takes is a little research.

    I never was a Girl Scout, but my sister was. I remember her going to a Girl Scout camp one summer. Now that male children and adolescent males are Girls Scouts, do males and females share the same sleeping quarters, etc., when they camp out? All the females and trans girls (biological males) sleep next to each other, use the same restroom etc. Do they all cram into one small cabin? How is this supposed to work? Or, is it politically incorrect to ask. Were any women here Girls Scouts, and how would they feel about males in their sleeping quarters, showers, restrooms, etc.

    I did a little research, and this is what they Girl Scouts say,

    “Q: How does Girl Scouts’ position on serving transgender youth apply to situations involving camping or volunteers?

    A: These situations are rare and are considered individually with the best interests of all families in mind. Should any girl requiring special accommodations wish to camp, GSUSA recommends that the local council makes similar accommodation that schools across the country follow in regard to changing, sleeping arrangements, and other travel-related activities. With respect to volunteers, Girl Scouts welcomes both male and female adult volunteers and has developed appropriate safeguards regarding roles and responsibilities to ensure that girls receive the proper supervision and support.”

    I love the way they phrase this p.c. crock of bull. By “transgender youth”, what they mean is the possibility of biological males camping with girls. Instead of just saying boys don’t camp here, sleep here, or shower here and leave it at that, they have to bend over backwards to accommodate this p.c. madness.

    All it takes is a Christopher, “Jessica”, Hambrook incident (sexual assault of homeless women in women’s shelters), or a Colleen Francis and “her male genitalia” in the locker room incident to drive parents away from Girl Scouts.

    As to “With respect to volunteers, Girl Scouts welcomes both male and female adult volunteers”, I can totally see Mr. Carlotta Sklodowska, tutu wearing Gregory Philip Schwartz, or Paul (Paula) Witherspoon as Girl Scout leaders. I better shut my mouth before they get any ideas and trans activists start demanding more rights.

    The person who made the generous donation should start their own organization that is designed to actually serve girls not the interest of transgender organizations. It’s possible. I’m sure there are millions of women who do want to put girls first.

    I wonder if the Girl Scouts are capitulating because they fear lawsuits from Gay Inc. (male run trans organizations).

    Gallus, I’m sorry for straying off topic, but I just had to vent.

    • Susan Nunes Says:

      The GSA will be sued out of existence if or when it happens a “trans” assaults a girl. As it should be.

    • Derrick Jensen Says:

      Sadly, I believe that if someone did start an organization designed to actually serve girls, that organization would be blasted and lied about by everyone from Jon Stewart to John Oliver to Katie Couric to Wikipedia to Yahoo, and the organizers would be deluged with rape and death threats, after which Stewart, Oliver, and Couric and Wikipedia and Yahoo would call the organizers (not those who delivered rape and
      death threats) bigots.

    • TheDailyMale Says:

      The most conservative of Girl Scout parents may be pushed over to the American Heritage Girls, an overtly fundamentalist organization. Fundies have been alarmed by decreasing numbers since the 80s but they may work a revival out of a new culture war, and trans seems to be giving it to them. Of course, women and feminism would be steamrollered by such a war.

      • Oceans Says:

        Oh yes, just wait til the rest of America gets a load of some of these fetishists. As long as we’ve had “pretty trans” like Cox and Mock, it’s easy for the public to be supportive. But once the creepy dudes get to stand under the full glare of the spotlight, the rightwingers will have their new culture war boogeyman.

      • Artemis Jade Says:

        I think the success of the trans movement is creating a once in a lifetime opportunity for Republican political strategists to appeal to certain Democratic women. No, I don’t see myself ever pulling the lever for a Republican but I see myself losing the ability to pull the lever for all these Democrats who grandly promote Trans legislation, never considering the impact on women and girls.

      • TheDailyMale Says:

        Now that I think of it, it could go either way. If trans remains perceived as the ultimate reparative therapy and bulwark of sex roles, there might not be so much backlash; but if more Colleen Francis cases occur, it’ll be brutal. @Oceans: agreed about the opening to grab a slice of the Democratic electorate.

    • Zemskull Says:

      I’m perplexed as to why boys would want to crash the Girl Scouts, considering that the group gets nowhere near the esteem and opportunities that the Boy Scouts do. People know that, in the Boy Scouts, achieving one’s Eagle Scout is a Big Deal. Eagles get letters from their senators, pictures in the newspaper, the whole bit. Most people don’t even know what the similar program is in the Girl Scouts: the Gold Award.

      • GallusMag Says:

        “the Gold Award”? Are you frakking kidding me? Lame.

      • kesher Says:

        Because, to little MTTs, the main draw is being treated like a girl and hanging out with the girls. At least the really young kids haven’t gotten to the autogynephile stage yet.

      • “At least the really young kids haven’t gotten to the autogynephile stage yet.”

        Well according to some trans women on reddit they alread had such urges when they were children and it gets worse and more intense when they grow up.

      • kesher Says:

        I’m not an expert on the subject, certainly, but it seems like whatever little gender non-conformity they start to show (by stealing relatives’ clothes) happens closer to puberty. In any event, I don’t trust self-described trans women’s stories about when the urges started. The autogynephiles are trying to hitch their wagons to gender non-conforming gay children; I can see them lying about being gnc starting at a very young age.

      • “I can see them lying about being gnc starting at a very young age.”

        No this isn’t about being gnc. It’s about autogynephila.

      • kesher Says:

        I know it is. What I’m saying is that they’re lying about being one of the gender non-conforming children (who, these days, are being dragged to gender clinics) in an effort to seem authentic. If they admit they started wanting to crossdress when they hit puberty or reached adulthood, it would be more obvious to everyone that this is a fetish.

    • Loup-loup garou Says:

      Girls, Inc. appears to have sidestepped all of this nonsense, probably because they keep a lower profile than the Girl Scouts. If anyone’s looking for an alternative, check ’em out.

      • TheDailyMale Says:

        Here’s a vintage Girls Club commercial that shows (between the shots of the gymnast, but then in 1973 gymnastics was all the rage) girls learning auto mechanics, making their own movie, and holding a fundraising meeting. The good old days, eh?

  20. This is also off topic, but I must share. “White’s experience led to a change in CATA’s policy which now prohibits employees from questioning or engaging in any conversation that relates to an individual’s gender”

    • Radical Grandma Says:

      I assume White still has his cock and balls? And gender is not over, just as racism isn’t over. Gender will never be over, even with “test tube babies” because as long as there are XY and XX chromosomes, there will be female and male. Real ones, not these fake pretenders.

      I may have to start carrying a weapon to the women’s restroom if this spreads. I’ve been sexually assaulted twice in my life as a young woman, and as an old one, feel even more vulnerable. And I know I can’t hold my own 5′ against a 52 yr old man who is stronger, taller and male.

  21. I’ve been trying to figure out why the Girl Scouts have sold girls down the river, and I think I’m beginning to understand.

    The Girl Scouts don’t need a measly donation when they get money from companies that rape the environment. Check out their corporate donor list.

    People in poor developing countries know how Nestle works. No, Nestle isn’t all chocolate, and environmentalists know their history. It’s a multinational corporation.

    The infant formula that Nestle pushed in poor developing countries is just part of their history. According to Nestle, it’s much better for poor people in developing countries to use infant formula mixed with unsafe drinking water (most water in developing countries is unsafe) than to just breast feed infants. Often families cannot afford to purchase formula after the free samples stop and by that time, the mother’s milk has dried up. Boycotts of Nestlé have been going on since the early 1970s. Water is another issue. As they plunder the world’s water supply, Nestle wishes people would just ignore what they have been doing for decades.

    As Nestle continues to steal the world’s water, especially in developing countries, and even in severe drought stricken California, the Girl Scouts continue to take corporate money from companies that that have a horrid environmental record. Let’s all go camping while there still is some water left. At least, for people who can afford to pay for expensive bottled water. Poor people don’t need water. What do they need for?

    Google “nestle bottled water controversy”. Or, go to the environmental and safe food and water website, Food and Water Watch, and type in Nestle.

    Google “Sierra Club” and Nestle.

    Alcoa Aluminum (Alcoa Foundation) is another corporate sponsor.

    The Girl Scouts toss girls under the bus for the politically b.s. (girls can have a penis don’t you know) all the while they take money from AT&T, Google, Nestle, and Alcoa.

    • KgSch Says:

      So, Girl Scouts is basically just like the HRC and all the other Big Trans Inc/alphabet soup groups?

      • GallusMag Says:

        It’s interesting that it’s just one woman. Same individual that issued the previous transgender Girl Scouts edict.

        From the initial link above that for some reason commenters aren’t threading to:

        “This is the second time in less than five years that a Girl Scouts council has taken a public stand to support transgender girls, and both times Ferland was at the center of the story.”

      • KgSch Says:

        All it takes is one cult member and the cult member’s followers. Considering the target age group for the girl scouts, the only “trans girls” would be little boys who have Munchhausen’s mommies.

        HRC and other big alphabet soup groups also accept donations from big polluters and organizations with shady business practices, like Bank of America.

      • MaryMacha Says:

        @KgSch I think this is an issue that catches people unawares. It sounds so “fair” when framed in terms of “rights”, so liberally appealing. It just flies under the radar because no one sees the Trojan horse. All it takes is one “ally” in a group of uninformed and kind-hearted people.

    • anon male Says:

      It’s amazing how all the post-gender / gender-free people only get to assert themselves as such after medical transition and that they

      1. all withhold that ability from the rest of humanity, deemed cis

      2. don’t realize that there’s a whole community of trans who have made this claim, independently, thinking that they were the first renegades to do so (it’s like fuckers, why don’t YOU read a book)

      • Radical Grandma Says:

        Yes, we all, I’m sure, run into that bias wherever we land.

        We are supposed to have no opinion as natal females, either, about who we know are female–those same natal females.

        Changing one’s outside appearance to “female” does nothing to further the rights of women, straight, lesbian or asexual, either.

        A lifelong fight for women’s rights have convinced me of that.

      • Radical Grandma Says:

        I left this reply over there, but don’t know if it will be “approved”.

        As a lifelong feminist activist, I would never want to change my “gender”. Speaking for myself, I have only wished to have the same equal rights enjoyed by men in every area of our society. I’ve wished this since I was a child but I didn’t want to have to act or be a man to get it. I’ve wished this since I was told by a boss that “men have families to raise” when I was a divorced mother of 2, raising my kids alone. I’ve been told that while men could get jobs for which I was more educated and experieced. I’m neither “femme” nor “butch”, but a woman with many facets to her life. I’m not a born male who has experienced the privilege of being male, but a born female who has truly suffered the gender bias of this country, along with every other natal woman I’ve ever know in my long life.

        As the trans movement wades into “identity politics”, nothing they are doing is helping the cause of women to attain those rights, for women to live as they wish, as straight, lesbian or non-sexual beings. This will always be the battle of true feminists who fight every day of our lives to de-privilege male society at large because of sex, race, color or any other determinant. It’s not a “culture war”, it’s a fight for our survival, not for those who think “brain sex” determines gender.

    • morag99 Says:

      I heard the Frontline theme music, and quickly left the room. I can’t watch them do that to children, and call it good and wholesome and progressive. Just. Can’t. Watch. Knowing that these documentaries are intended to “educate” the public — in this case, the good, sensitive, thinking consumers of public television — and that, currently, they can’t be framed any other way except sympathetic to the genderist narratives.

      I can’t be the only one whose nervous system over-reacts? Maybe if I had something stiff to drink beforehand …

      • GallusMag Says:

        I was surprised at how objectively presented this was. They skipped over all the insane munchaussen Honey-boo-boo stuff. Still, they did an amazing job, I think. It’s amazing to finally see professional reporting and documentation of this medical malpractice.

      • But they didn’t mention the blatant homophobia did they?

      • GallusMag Says:

        They didn’t mention it, but they showed it. There was no commentary from the filmmakers.

      • AreUSayingWhatUThink Says:

        I can’t bear to watch it either. It’s not good for my mental state. It is absolutely demoralizing. GallusMag bravely watched for the rest of us, and reports back that it was professional reporting that was amazing. I think I’ll have to read about it before I watch.

      • GallusMag Says:

        I wouldn’t say it was professional reporting that was amazing, rather that I was amazed that there was professional reporting. 😉

    • morag99 Says:

      Thanks for the report, Gallus. I’m surprised, not because of Frontline –which is usually very good — but because I didn’t think that a balanced examination of trans was currently possible on TV.

      Anyway, I think now that I will watch it, or at least give it a try. Still, the subject itself — the unnecessary meddling with children’s minds, brains and bodies — horrifies me.

      • GallusMag Says:

        It was very surprising considering how much of PBS funding comes from BigPharma.

      • Mochi Says:

        watching it now…. The 9 year old who goes by “Daniel”, I feel very sad for, seems like such a nice kid. I’m now at the part where the family is visiting the “children’s gender clinic” in Chicago. Did anyone else get the sense that the doctors were “leading” with their questions, really approaching this in a way that would intensify the kid’s feelings of dysphoria?

        Those parents seem so willing to bend themselves into pretzels to make their kid feel comfortable (more than any parents I’ve ever met, certainly my own- what planet are they from!?), if they are so liberal minded, why can’t they tell Daniel that you don’t need to be male to do any of these so-called “boy” things? Don’t MOST females feel uncomfortable once they start to learn about the way society views their bodies?

      • Mochi Says:

        “the medications are very expensive, they can be 15-25k a year.”


    • lestoille Says:

      probably the best documentary i have seen on the issue so far. the producers really illuminated the lack of research and data supporting these treatments, and how justifiably concerned the parents are. unlike the munchaussen parents, you can tell the parents in this doc struggle with doubt and worry. these are the families who would usually not appear in the media pushing their children into the spotlight, so it’s so important their experiences are made visible. Also it was good how they showed just how significant the internet and youtube is, for FTMs especially, with all the “x months on T” vlogs.

      and then the heartbreaking case of gianna/john, who came out as a lesbian and her conservative dad told her “No. you’re not going to be part of that world.” so the next logical step was for her to become a boy. anyone with half a brain should be able to watch that and see how transition is literally erasing gender non-conforming children and in particular homosexual teens.

      but her father doesnt want her to become a boy either, because he knows it’s not possible, and being a non-nonsense patriarch he wont allow himself to be gaslighted into believing otherwise. Even though he is a retrograde lesbophobic asshole, it was a real shame to see at the end that he finally consented for her to take T because she punched out another teen girl on T at her school. it’s just not going to end well for this family and for gianna. you can just tell.

      i like how the documentary ended with a doctor saying “we hope we’re doing the right thing”. a nice way to emphasize that this is all experimental and possibly (definitely) dangerous.

      • GallusMag Says:

        Thank you for sharing your impressions of the show. God yes, poor Gianna and her homophobic dad.

        Another thing that struck me is how rapidly the kids came to realize that they could not overcome their childhood socialization and “blend in” to their target sex- which is the entire stated rationale of undergoing these childhood “treatments”. I laughed when the blonde young man began to “pass” and realized he needed to be out as a “transwoman” in order to hold onto the deferential treatment accorded to him as a male.

      • Susan Nunes Says:

        I don’t see it ending well for any of these kids profiled. None of them fit in, and none ever will, tragically. The one boy, Ian/Ariel, has body image issues almost identical to anorexics, and then he is totally bent out of shape when his female friends actually talk about things that women and girls talk about because they go through them (whether or not to get pregnant, menstrual periods, etc.). Ian has no concept whatsoever of the reality of the female experience. His delusions of being a “girl” are shattered when girls/young women talk about things girls and women talk about. He has no understanding of the likelihood no man would ever want him as a “woman,” let alone have a family with him. He is at high risk for depression and suicide if he actually goes through the surgical mutilation and things don’t work out for him which they seldom do. There was no way this episode was pro-trans propaganda. The ethical and health concerns were the main undercurrents here. It is almost like the producers read this blog, other transcritical blogs, works by the likes of Sheila Jeffreys and Paul McHugh, and took notes of the real issues with transgenderism.

      • Zemskull Says:

        The scene I found the most poignant was a minute into Ariel’s segment, in which she said she liked the puberty blockers because she could stay a child. It made me wonder how much of preteen transgenderism results from the fairly common fear of puberty and subsequent adulthood.

      • kesher Says:

        “Ian has no concept whatsoever of the reality of the female experience. His delusions of being a “girl” are shattered when girls/young women talk about things girls and women talk about.”

        It’s interesting the prevalence of narcissistic personality disorder among people seeking transition. I used to think NPD causes the desire to transition, but I wonder if it might be the other way around, at least for the younger, not yet blatantly misogynistic “trans girls”. The desire to transition would definitely do a number on one’s sense of self.

      • GallusMag Says:

        @Susan- also striking how Arial says it is much easier to be transgender than to be a feminine boy and that being “in that in-between space is where difficulties begin to occur”.

      • Annoyed Bi Chick Says:

        Someone should tell young Ian that Ariel is also a boy’s name. Someone ring Arik Sharon in the afterlife and tell him he’s a woman now!

        (Otherwise, I’m desperately afraid the boy has named himself after the lead character in Disney’s The Little Mermaid, which is just depressing. Come on, folks, I came up with an original SCA name that isn’t weird or particularly odd-sounding; this convincing alter ego thing can be done.)

    • Loup-loup garou Says:

      Amazing — what comes through loud and clear is that 99% percent of this is motivated by discomfort with social sex roles, and in particular, with gendered clothing.

      The article by the twenty year old FTT who goes by Isaac is particularly interesting. She has essentially arrived at the idea that your body doesn’t have to determine your personality or vice-versa, but without explicitly taking the logical next step of simply stating that gender is artificial. I get the sense, though, that on some level she realizes that. But since she has already medically transitioned, it’s not surprising she isn’t in a rush to completely drop the word gender from her vocabulary.

      • GallusMag Says:

        I thought Isaac was very courageous to make her segment. I hope she knows that peer supports now exist by and for other women that want to, or have, gone off testosterone.

      • Susan Nunes Says:

        I finally got around to watching it. Every single case shown on this program is tragic. It is so wrong to put kids through the puberty blockers and so forth, just because they have interests or personality traits than most of their own sex.

      • puzzled Says:

        Bless Isaac, because that is something I can show to my 17 year old would-be FTM and say, “Here is a view you should consider.” I have not watched the show yet but I will make myself do it. Living in the middle of it makes me kind of disinclined and I’ve seen so many “the wonders of pediatric transing” shows that I have a kneejerk avoidance reaction. If they brought out the groupthink going on regarding FTM via youtube, that is particularly important. Good on ’em.

      • GallusMag Says:

        @Puzzled- Isaac will also be live on TRTV Real Talk with Mark Angelo Cummings and Lynna Lopez this upcoming Thursday.

      • Radical Grandma Says:

        I just left this comment over at

        Ann and Robert H. Lurie Children’s Hospital of Chicago should be condemned by the medical community for experimenting with children.

        The patriarchy loves this “transgender” trend, though. It’s making big bucks for a lot of industries.

        Why can’t we just accept that there are “feminine” males and “masculine” females as behavior? And it’s also a slap in the face to the women’s movement, who of late have been under attack by these individuals who attempt to “pass” as females and are trying to take over the movement by not only their presence, but in formulating feminist theory. Most of us, however, aren’t buying it since those in the trans movement aren’t concentrating on the condition of women, they are exploiting it to their own advantage and sexual paraphilias.

        Women will never be free until we’re done with gender stereotyping. The trans movement does nothing to change that stereotyping–look at the glammed up sexually provocative persona of Jenner, for instance. Autogynephilia is alive and kicking in many MTT individuals and it is no substitute for the way women are treated in our society and the many roadblocks in our path, part of which is the class issue as well.

  22. Susan Nunes Says:

    It was that good? Well, maybe I will take a look at it in the near future. I figured it was just the garden variety trans propaganda. So much of the trans propaganda is right out of the Murray-Herrnstein racist classic “The Bell Curve,” but with a lot less vocal opposition to it. Trans explanations for their disorders or sexual fetishes is just junk science, quackery.

    • Zemskull Says:

      Hi Susan Nunes: In my opinion, the Frontline documentary was the most balanced I’ve seen on this topic in the mainstream broadcast media. Most documentaries I’ve seen don’t even mention that these children will be unable to have children of their own, but I recall the topic coming up at least twice on the Frontline documentary as the children were being counseled by professionals. Ariel, the MTT, seemed fine with sterility, as he was horrified at the thought at being able to produce sperm. That was a rather sad revelation; it seems rather self-hating to be horrified at one’s natural processes. A person who would be repulsed about producing any other natural secretion–saliva, for example–would be considered mentally ill.

      • Susan Nunes Says:

        I totally agree with you. I liked this show so much, I bought a download of it for future reference. I have no doubt the producers did a LOT of research on this issue and were not afraid to go up against the popular pro-trans mentality of the media.

        I have to ask if anybody knows of an organized boycott of the upcoming Jazz Jennings and Jenner programs. There really needs to be pushback on this.

        As for Ian/Ariel, he has some major, major psychological problems very similar to a person suffering from anorexia.

      • Zemskull Says:

        Boycotts are risky, and can actually bring publicity to a product. Think of the Married With Children boycott years ago. The relatively obscure show hit #1 the following week.

        I have a wait-and-see attitude about the Jenner and Jazz shows. As with the two recent Kardashian shows dedicated to the Jenner topic, some interesting tidbits came out amongst the overall positivity; specifically, the way Jenner turned his female offspring against each other.

      • GallusMag Says:

        I agree- the more exposure the better.

      • I'm No Cissie Says:

        “Ariel” is not fine with being sterile. He isn’t accepting the fact that his body is going to produce sperm and that this is his road to genetic parenthood. He wants to forgo that, but he collapses into a blubbering ball of denial when his female friends discuss their dreams and plans of being pregnant someday. And this was not addressed by the therapist on-camera at all.

        He doesn’t seem fine with accepting what his body will never be able to do after he transitions.

        He isn’t accepting reality and the adults around him are not giving the needed guidance, from what I can see in the film.

        He doesn’t want what he’s got and he doesn’t want what science can give him. He really wants what actual women have and that is only a fantasy.

  23. CKDexterHaven Says:

    And now, according to BBC Woman’s Hour, Brucinda Jenner is one of the top 10 most influential women in the world. The space for women gets smaller and smaller.

    • Some day the top ten will be only men with fetishes.

      • kesher Says:

        Eventually the media will get bored with this, so, as much as I fear a dystopian future, I doubt it’ll go that far. If there isn’t a serious backlash, maybe these top ten lists will always have at least one token MTT to shut them up.

        It’ll be interesting to see the meltdowns when the media get bored. What will the narcissists do when they’re no longer the center of attention?

      • lestoille Says:


        i agree the media will get tired of this issue. recently i was looking for documentaries about anorexia, and all i could find were old ones from the 90s and a couple from the early 00s. it’s not like the issue has gone away (it’s probably gotten worse since now we live in the era of instagram and photoshop), but the media clearly doesn’t give a fuck any more. Old news. i thought this was interesting because i remember back in the 90s anorexia was a “hot issue” and was reported on a great deal.

        eating disorders are similar to trans in that they are both “freak shows.” Normal people are fascinated by those who willingly starve themselves or butcher their genitals in search of a false bodily ideal. however the fascination has a limited shelf life, clearly.

    • Radical Grandma Says:

      And “Brucinda” still has his cock and balls. Even without them, he still would be a he, according to his chromosomes.

      I’m so tired of this bullshit. I will never accept men in my circle of women friends as anything other than men, no matter how “girly” they try to present themselves. And that is exactly what they’re trying to do while retaining the male privileges they have enjoyed their entire lives.

      The brain does not determine sex–the chromosomes do, no matter how they try to push this “concept”.

    • Mortadella Says:

      Oh, seriously? What in the ever loving fuck…

  24. Radical Grandma Says:

    I’m so damned sick of being told, as a natal woman, that I am wrong all the time about what it means to be a woman. Being a woman is not a “role” as we see it being done by the fake-breasted, hormone-taking males who glam up and pose for the cameras in their cleavage revealing tops and short skirts, with the “sex kitten” pout and wide-eyed stare going on. If anything, “transwomen” are doing more than their share in perpetuating sex roles.

    And it especially pisses me off that natal men, who purport to be “woman” are mainly the ones doing it, along with those “progressives” they’ve managed to string along with their bullshit. I won’t be cowed by them or their bullshit, because I’m able to speak about the condition of women with authenticity as are most born women.

  25. Radical Grandma Says:

    More proof about what natal women complain about re the “transgender” movement. This is the kind of bullshit that convinces me that these people have no fucking idea of what it is to be a woman.

    It almost makes you wish their feet are ruined in a couple of years.

    Gawd, talk about sex role stereotypes.

    And for the record, there is no way a man’s pelvis will ever be like a born woman’s, so their walk has to be a put on as well.

    • Chippy Says:

      @Radical Grandma

      This sentence from your feminizationsecrets link:

      ” (Though why anybody would want to wear flats instead of heels is beyond me!)”

      Oh, the hilarity! I laughed so hard that I nose-spit my wine.

      Well, I’m a natal woman so of course, I always wear six inch heels, nylons and short miniskirt whenever I’m baking muffins and worrying my pretty little head about about what shade of fire engine red my nails should be this week. Oh, I just don’t know, should I go with a french braid or sultry hair bun.


      • TheDailyMale Says:

        You give up sports when you transition? I’d like to see them run, skateboard or ski in heels.

      • Dogtowner Says:

        You really think these guys engage in any physical activity other than looking at themselves in the mirror? Their fetishism/computer addiction is a 24/7 proposition, don’t you know.

    • MaryMacha Says:

      I was recently informed that all the butt shaking some women do when they walk is actually learned behavior and in some cases actually taught! I say “some” because most women just walk with pretty even hip momentum. As a woman, I can’t imagine intentionally affecting an exaggerated sway, roomy hips or not. I think men who do this run the risk of developing some alignment problems later on, as well as ruined feet. Did you know that women who have worn high heels their whole lives can have problems wearing flat shoes? It’s a form of foot binding IMO. (Though in the case of MTTs it might be a form of foot bondage.)

      • Chippy Says:


        I think you’re right about that. My paternal grandmother always wore heels because she was short. She couldn’t wear flats for as long as I knew her.

        But the French aristocrat men were the ones who invented the high heels back in the powdered wig days of oppression. There’s got to be a misogynist reason why the men stopped wearing them and the women started. I have nothing against women who want to wear them. To each their own. but I like running around too much and won’t wear them.

        As far as the hip sway – butt shakin’, I don’t even know what that is.

      • Oak and Ash Says:

        “I was recently informed that all the butt shaking some women do when they walk is actually learned behavior and in some cases actually taught!”

        Women who want to be perceived as “feminine” tend to keep their feet close together–sometimes even putting them directly in front of the other–which produces a lot of sway. This is exaggerated if the woman slouches a little–think of models sashaying down a runway–and walks slowly. No coincidence that all these things make a woman look more vulnerable.

        So, yes, it’s absolutely learned, and self-appointed gender police insist on teaching it to women who refuse to adopt it on their own. I know this because people have criticized me since childhood for “walking like a man.” When I was in my teens and twenties, female friends and relatives would sometimes try to tell me to use a shorter stride and move at a slower pace in order to be “less offputting” to men. One boyfriend in college even claimed I was damaging my legs and back by not walking like a “normal” woman.

        If men want to walk in a way that weakens them, it’s fine by me, as long as they stop trying to inflict it on us.

      • Chippy Says:

        @Oak And Ash

        Well, I’ll be. Learn somethin’ new every day. I can’t believe you were told by female relatives and, by a bf no less, to walk like a normal woman You’re a woman so ipso facto, whatever walk you do, is normal. That just goes without saying. If you were left handed, would they try to make you use your right hand too? JK (I’m sure your fam really did have what they thought were your best intentions at heart, not to sure about bf though.)

        I have to borrow a pair of heels from some friend now because I’m going to go to Walmart and try walking like a feminine woman and end up on one of those weird people at Walmart funny photo collections. I’m going to wear an obnoxious hat and wig too. Then, I’ll be a real girl. LOLZ!

      • Oak and Ash Says:


        The attempts to get me to walk (or dress or style my hair, etc.) to be more appealing to men were only intermittent. I come from a working class culture that didn’t require that much feminine performance–little girls were free to wear comfortable clothes and run around, while older, married women dressed practically and spoke their minds–but young women were expected to look pretty and act deferent toward men until they had a husband and a few children. I never got the hang of it.

      • Chippy Says:

        @Oak and Ash

        My family comes from a working class background too. I kind of get what you’re saying. That practicality is the thing in marriage but young unmarried girls are expected to be pretty and girly. I never really thought of the dynamics the way you’re stating it, but it’s sort of true. I was looking at relatives during the Fourth and all the married moms were practical but the unmarried daughters were dressed… hmm, what’s the word…cute and pretty. I don’t have a problem with that. They did look cute but it’s not my style.

        But the real interesting part is when you said ” act deferent toward men”. I finally understand why I have a few male relatives who are uncomfortable around me.

    • KgSch Says:

      MaryMacha is right about high heels. They are designed to cripple your feet and make it so you can’t run away. And of course many TV shows and movies promote the belief that they are totally safe to run in. (A good example of that propaganda is the new Jurassic Park film. In the original film, Lex Murphy and Dr. Ellie Sattler wear normal clothes and sneakers or hiking boots when running from dinosaurs in the jungle. The new movie has a whole section proving how totally safe it is for Claire
      Dearing, the female lead, to walk around the jungle and run from dinosaurs in “those ridiculous shoes.”) Flip-flops aren’t exactly good for you either, but are probably okay if you’re going to the beach. And they aren’t coded as “unsafe things for females to wear”.

      I do think that if men enjoy heels, toxic makeup, and flimsy, degrading clothing so much then they should wear it and not demand women wear it. But that doesn’t make them women at all. They are just following male-identified femininity.

      Stereotypes that men say about women are often very true about them. For example, my mom says that the biggest gossips on the planet are the men she works with. I went to her company picnic with her and she is right.

      I don’t make it a goal in my life to soothe other people’s fragile egos, so I don’t pretend men are women (and especially lesbians!) or vice-versa. It’s incredibly male-typically behavior to force other people to play along with your fantasy/sexual fetish. Also, I do not want to be friends with boundary-violating freaks.

      • Chippy Says:


        I think you and your mom are on to something. Especially about “male-typical behavior to force other people to play along with your fantasy.” I have noticed that men tend to tell women to act the way they imagine their ideal woman partner to act like. I don’t have time for that silliness either.

        What sort of made it all clear to me about mtt was my experience in my first job. I was sort of stalked by a man pretending to be a woman but still identifying as man. I was trying to be nice but then he blindsided me with a most unwelcome kiss and when I told him to nope. He started following me around like a puppy at work. Finally, I complained and crazily enough, I was told I was at fault for “luring” him. Like he was a fish or somethin’. I found another job. And that’s how I found out, born men are born men.

      • KgSch Says:


        That’s just disturbing and awful the way your employers treated you. And that’s the way it always goes: when a woman treats a man with basic human courtesy, she’s “leading him on” and wants a relationship. I’ve had men try to talk to me/hassle me into “dating” them for the most bizarre reasons. Yes, me telling you about that poisonous spider on your shoulder clearly means I want to date you and not just I’m just being a decent person trying to save you from an ER visit. I’m a lesbian anyway.

        I think the whole thing is projection bias. It also applies to racist stereotypes too. White talking heads, with thinly veiled racism, call black people “lazy”, yet who was the group of people who enslaved another group of people because they were too lazy too pick their own damn cotton? (Hint: the answer is white people.)

        Men call women gossips, yet there was this study showing that when women talked about 15% of the time during a group discussion, men believed that men and women were talking an equal amount of time. When women talked 30% of the time, the men said the women were “dominating the discussion”.

        Also, on average crowd scenes in movies show 17-20% women extras despite us making up 51% of the population. Did you know that surgeons are about 17-20% women too (and this occurs in other high-end professions). It’s like subtle training to say “yeah, there can be some professional women, but not too many.” Such things get increasingly ridiculous as the number of women getting into to colleges and medical school has started to equal or surpass the number of men doing this. (And no, the poor menz aren’t being discriminated against. A woman usually needs to have a bachelor’s degree if she wants to make what a man with a high school diploma makes. High school is free; college costs a ton of money.)

        Some states have tried to pass laws cracking down on cyber-bulling (including revenge porn) that happens to women. Male misogynists say things like, “why should the feelings of women be considered more important than the rights of the average American?” (exact quote). But, statistically speaking, the numerical majority of Americans are women.

        You are right about men trying to tell women how to act. Men often will just outright tell women what to do to be an ideal partner. Case example: every boyfriend a my cousin has ever had ever. (Also, I think the myth that a woman can change a man for the better is a social myth designed to convince women that it’s worthwhile to invest their energy in men. “Sure, he doesn’t have a job and still expects you to cook and clean for him when you get home from working your ass off at your job, but if you just love him enough, he’ll change!”)

      • Oak and Ash Says:


        That’s appalling. I swear, it’s almost as if some men think, “She didn’t spit on me as she walked by–she must want me.” It depresses me that so little has changed since I was in my twenties, except that women seem less allowed to say no to men.


        Not only do studies find men talk more than women, they lie more, as well. In fact, men are also more likely than women to make up accusations of abuse, which I think is why so many of them are worried about false allegations of rape–another example of projection.

      • Chippy Says:

        @ KgSch

        Oh, I’m so over that place and the mtt. It really affected me at the time but as soon as I left, I became myself again, but for a bit, I was really confused, questioning myself. It was like living a soap opera in my head that I couldn’t really explain or understand.

        And that study you mentioned, I know it’s right. I think some men just zero in on women, and it’s not even what a woman is saying, it’s just that she’s talking. So they make it out to be bigger than it is, take it out of context, ignore the point being made and stuff like that. So I can totally see how men could think that a women talking 30% of the time is “dominating” but they’ll ignore that the other women who are barely talking or the other men that are throwing out guy quips the entire time.

        About revenge porn, I don’t even understand why that’s not against the law already. I read some news article awhile back about a woman who was the victim of revenge porn and some court ruled that because the camera that took the pics belonged to the man, the pictures belong to the man. As if the context, the intent or the nature of the relationship at the time they were taken were completely irrelevant. My advice, all women who are with a guy and take nude pics for him or allow him to take nude pics, should make sure they get a limp dick shot of the guy so she’d have something to kind of hang over his head if the relationship or whatever went sour. btw, anyone who reduces revenge pics to women’s sensitive feelings, isn’t really thinking with a complete set of neurons firing.

    • Fruitopia Says:

      The woman who runs that site, is a real woman, not a trans*

  26. Bob Doublin Says:
    They are vertebrates just like we are!!
    How long before the trannies start claiming this happened to them? Forget bee stings. Just claim you spent a week in Death Valley,even if you don’t even know where it is.

  27. river Says:

    Toronto, again:

    Woman waited on interminably long wait list to get into a group to help women with PTSD. The group was open to fake women.

    “We racked our hearts talking about our abuse and wrestled with ourselves over what steps to take to recover. As the group went on it became apparent that the trans* women were very distracted with trying to imitate the other women’s expressions of pain and humiliation. I would make a statement about what happened to me, taking a risk tentatively and with unsureness in my voice. Then a trans* women or two would imitate my tone of voice and downtrodden body language. It come across as not just imitative. My pain and the struggle of my trauma was a costume to be tried on. “

      • margaret Says:

        Remember in the Jenner/Sawyer Interview when Kris asks Bruce why he always sits in the same spot in HER bathroom. He’s taking laydee lessons and aping her ‘femininity’. Another autogynephile clue that Sawyer failed to pick up.

      • river Says:

        The hospital involved is under the same ‘care’ umbrella as the sponsors and supporters of Cotton Ceiling.

        (Nah. I don’t have tv. )

    • AreUSayingWhatUThink Says:

      OMGoddess!!!!!! I have PTSD – or I had it – no, let me think back over this last week…yeah, I have PTSD.

      I would feel raped if that happened to me in a group. I was always saying to my therapist, when I could afford to have one, “it was like being raped,” trying to explain the intensity of my feelings, and then we would go over why it WASN’T as bad as rape – but it was pretty bad. I don’t know why it is so important to me to put my traumatic experiences….on some kind of number line, “in there somewhere,” its not as bad as rape, but it’s worse than X. I really struggled with that in therapy, trying to grasp at all how bad it was. Maybe I will never grasp it. Generally no one in my life knows what happened to me, maybe none of us ever understand everything another human being goes through.

      Anyway, I could NOT would NOT ever be in a support group of any kind with bio males in it EVER.

  28. @river,

    That article broke my heart. Women in a support group for women with PTSD should never have to share their painful personal experiences with males. This includes males who cross dress or call themselves “women”.

    “My pain and the struggle of my trauma was a costume to be tried on.”

    That is what it is to them. They have no idea how women feel.

    Everyone of the women should have walked and and left the men to themselves.

    • river Says:

      I imagine there was a lot of dissociation going on among the women. How else could they survive it. When you read her blog, you see she spends a very long time deflecting her needs to focus on the T needs and being apologetic. She needs our support.

      • MaryMacha Says:

        Which is why I think we should go over and comment over there. It might make a difference in how she decides to proceed.

      • atranswidow Says:

        Yes, River this article has affected me deeply and I’ve been mulling over a reply to her for a few days. Dissociation is one way of coping that I know wives use when dealing with very similar abuse within their intimate relationships with a man who crosses the gender dividing line from male to female and thereby appropriates and invalidates the partners own lived experience of being a woman.

        i know that my husband used me almost as a learning tool for his own version of femininity and that left me feeling violated and stripped of my identity to the point that I suffered PTSD and the relived trauma of an episode of abuse as a child. I do not see any psychiatric literature addressing this. If it were more understood then it would be obvious not to place women and trans women in the same group. But as ever everything comes down to the ”need” to be inclusive. Who’s need? Not mine and certainly not women like Lily.

      • Mochi Says:

        Man, you women who went over there to give support, y’all rock.

        This woman’s story is heart breaking.

        I was in a relationship for several years with a woman who had been abused by her step father repeatedly from the time she was 9 until she was taken by DYS at age 14. He would attack her and her sister on a nightly basis. She had a miscarriage from him when she was ten. Ten years old.

        Her pain was so profound I can not even begin to comprehend. It utterly destroyed her. She was so worn down from the 2 year long criminal trial to convict him, that when she was later raped in college she didn’t even want to press charges. I couldn’t force her. She said she didn’t want to go through it all again. Her family disowned her for having that sack of garbage incarcerated. She was isolated, terrified, and deeply ashamed. SHE felt responsible for breaking her family up, when her parents lost custody of all their children. She blamed herself for trying to get help.

        I couldn’t imagine sending that woman to a support group to be mocked by men in dresses. That is inhumane, I can’t even.

        And OF COURSE, some AGP has to show up to start an argument about “Brain Sex” on this woman’s blog. It’s like, no where is off limits to them. If there’s a “KEEP OUT” sign, they get this “primal urge” to “penetrate.” “Thrust” their way in, break down those barriers, and give those transphobic feminists the business end of the “lady stick.”

        This woman bares her heart about how violated she felt to have males just invade a female space and take ownership, and sure as rain, just such a one shows up as THE FIRST commenter. Poetic.
        They have no sense of boundaries. It’s very striking. I think even most regular males would have enough sense to leave that woman alone on her blog.

      • morag99 Says:

        “This woman bares her heart about how violated she felt to have males just invade a female space and take ownership, and sure as rain, just such a one shows up as THE FIRST commenter. Poetic.”

        I know! And the very first comment! A comment in which he (tries) to soften her up with empathy-speak, before educating her on her supposed misperceptions, and then making it all about the trans, and how the poor dears have no choice but to learn womanhood through mimicry. The implicit message being that, not only shouldn’t she trust her own perceptions, but that her sympathy should have flowed toward these men instead of away from them. It’s as if he showed up precisely to illustrate why femulating men (abuse victims or not) made that therapy group unsafe for women.

      • GallusMag Says:

        Sickened beyond words.
        This is “Kay Brown”:

      • Mochi Says:

        It’s nice to see that Candace had such a successful career in STEM, it’s such a difficult field for most women to break into, especially with their “lady-brains” being not so good at maths or physics and the like. Well, quite a list of accomplishments to say the least (for a Laaydee-braine- that is, heh)


      • Ashland Avenue Says:

        “An internationally recognized thought leader”?! WTF does that even mean?! Yeah, what we need is yet another tranny telling women what to think. Sorry dude, not happening. What a despicable man.

        That post by Lily is invaluable.

      • atranswidow Says:

        I noticed that first comment by Kay Brown too. I’ve exchanged views with him on Awesome Cat’s blog on the subject of autogynephilia. He considers himself ”true trans”, married to a man and has fostered several children. There are podiums for exchanging views on autogynephilia and there are places where you have to keep out when your experience is not relevant and, in fact, downright irrelevant if not intrusive and abusive. I wouldn’t even begin to speak or intrude on many women’s experience here as lesbians, yet I feel a bond with you all as a woman. Something that not even a ”true trans ” can comprehend.

      • Susan Nunes Says:

        It was hard to believe “Kay” has had any career at all. There were spelling errors all over those his posts. He sounded barely literate.

  29. gaydude50 Says:

    For something that is “over” it seems to be absolutely the most important thing in the world right now.

    • gaydude50 Says:

      Sorry, I should have been more clear because I know that sarcasm doesn’t always translate well. It would be the most amazing thing in the world if gender were over. Fem gay guys, butch women and the whole spectrum in between could be free to express themselves outside of patriarchal definitions of gender.

      We know this isn’t true. Instead we have the hyper-sexualized, porny Miley Cyrus who “kissed a girl and liked it” like Katy Perry telling us that gender is over.

      Has she met Caitlyn?

      It’s really depressing.

      • I'm No Cissie Says:

        Yeah, it isn’t over for the girls who prefer to play with trucks and climb trees and the boys who like pink and Barbie – they’re being brought to shrinks and endocrinologists for a little human experimentation. Far from over.

    • kesher Says:

      I don’t know how Joan Jett would feel about it, but I bet Laura Jane Grace would lose his shit if gender were over. If gender’s over, what leverage does he have to get women to do what he wants and to worship him?

      • haw Says:

        my personal theory on mister Tom Gabel (aka Laura Jane Grace) is that, having built a band, reputation, and career on being someone who was speaking ‘authentically’ about his ‘struggle’, he found himself in crisis when he then got significantly richer and realized that he had lost the ‘authenticity’ that comes with some sort of hardship. (being white and male his only hardship was being poor).

        He realized then that he needed a new crisis. Building upon his history of cross-dressing and his narccicistic need to be the center of attention—which was threatened when his wife became pregnant—he realized that he could have a new “struggle”, a new “authenticity,” and a new “look at me everyone” cry if he declared that he was a trans woman.

        yeah, he bugs me a lot. He’s a violent dude who thinks that Madonna = womanhood, and he sure ticks a lot of the autogynephile boxes. he may have gotten to the transition point slightly sooner than most autogynephiles because of his celebrity and money.

      • Radical Grandma Says:

        I am especially concerned about the claims that trans make about “knowing” at preschool level what “sex” they really are. Children fantasize a lot. And I had to look up “Laura Jane Grace” who claims he “knew” at age 4. Along with his parents’ divorce, his extensive drug use and juvenile delinquency, Thomas needed intensive therapy and obviously didn’t get it.

        So, my 5 yr old great-grandson has entertained a number of fantasies over the year, which, if taken seriously, would have erased his existence as a normal male kid. A month ago, he wanted to be a robot. Should we have had his human brain removed and replaced with a computer? Of course not. Previously, he wanted to be “like” me, a female, and more lately wants to be his dad. Kids have active imaginations, and parents who take their wishes far too seriously are practicing a form of child abuse when they start “transitioning” these young children at a very early age with drugs, suggestions, and encouragement. And who knows how fucked up their future will be?

        Children are malleable in the hands of those who they see as their protectors when those protectors allow a child’s imagination to rise above common sense and interfere in the future of the child.

      • “Children are malleable in the hands of those who they see as their protectors when those protectors allow a child’s imagination to rise above common sense and interfere in the future of the child.”

        EVERY child wants to be this or that. That means every child is danger because once they say they want to be boys/girls there is a chance that their parents jump on the trans train. Of course lesbian and gay children are the most vulnerable.

        I guess number of “trans kids” will explode until people with common sense stop this insanity.

        Instead of letting children be children the next stop is the gender clinic. This is going to be a disaster.

      • KgSch Says:

        Tom Gabel/Laura Jane Grace (always the three names) is a raging male misogynist, but gets a free pass because he’s trans. Yet another entry under, “I don’t think dumbass liberals truly believe these guys are women.”


        I’m always skeptical when these guys, especially autogynephiles claim to have “felt like a girl” since the age of four. I have seen cases of men who say they started cross-dressing in their 20s and didn’t know why they liked it but accepted themselves, go to claiming they started cross-dressing at the age of four and need estrogen now or they will suicide.

        You are completely right about the way children behave. Parents who claim their child is really the opposite sex are taking their child’s make-believe play way too seriously. I still remember playing robots, aliens, Harry Potter, and various other fictional characters with my brother and friends when I was a kid. When I was in high school, my friend and I watched a TV show where two of the characters strongly resembled us, so we had an on-going joke that we were just like those characters and would sometimes call each other by those character names and we sometimes continue the joke when we happen to see each other. (I have moved to a different city and state from my hometown, but go back to visit on holidays.)

        I just don’t get why people can’t let their kids have a childhood and have to force their bullshit hangups on them. It’s perfectly normal for a girl to want to play outdoors and wear comfortable clothing or for a boy to want to play with dolls.

    • AreUSayingWhatUThink Says:

      Let me translate that into German for you: “Gender uber alles.” There, clarity at last.

    • Radical Grandma Says:

      What the hell does a 22 yr old celebrity know except fame-whoring? And calling Joan Jett, a 56 yr old female entertainer, a “girl” as well as calling a man one? Obviously, MC is still a pretty mixed up person and not that bright.

      Admit it, MC.

    • morag99 Says:

      Can Miley’s tongue stop being all “over” the internet, then? Please. Because I think that Miley’s tongue, hanging out that way, IS gender. Though I’m no longer sure about these kinds of things. The criticism she’s been subjected to has certainly had a strong misogynistic flavour, to which she seems strangely, and childishly, impervious. Is the tongue sticking out mockery? Is it a symptom of illness — of the girl-child-star’s life being marred by both over-indulgence and exploitation? What the hell is going on?

      But her supporting Tom Gabel/Laura Jane Grace reveals yet more confusion. I can’t imagine what Joan Jett, a mature woman, is thinking! And then the visuals: these two small women, on either side, flanking that terrifying man (“girl,” according to Cyrus) at centre stage, like bodyguards for the queer cause — in other words, for the cause of men to expand their predatory proclivities even further, under the guise of liberation. Embracing, smiling, and showing a positive attitude are mandatory. Tongue-wagging is, I suppose, an asset.

      I also saw a picture of Tom/Laura sporting the “Gender is Over” t-shirt. Jesus Christ, what a horror he is. And how dependent these men are on an irony-impaired public. If gender is over, so is he. Duh. What that stupid t-shirt really means to convey is that SEX is over, and “sex” always means “women” and “women” means hardly anything at all — except, of course, when men are playing at it. Then it’s the pinnacle of human becoming, the unfurling of authenticity. Penis required. Even Joan and Miley are out of luck.

  30. Radical Grandma Says:

    If people would read more, they’d be able to understand the power of the trans lobbying efforts which have been relentless. This old piece showing a change in the DSM is one piece. I suppose everyone knows that Shannon Minter of the “National Center for Lesbian Rights” is a “transman”, but does everyone? That shows a favorable bias toward the trans “community”.

    In one fell swoop, they were able to erase a few fetishes from the DSM and make “sex change” a “normal” activity without prejudice. Of course, this change required very little science and a hell of a lot of imagination, esp the non-proven “brain sex theory”.

    What else is a fetish but an over-active imagination? No wonder people don’t take psychiatry/psychology too seriously.

  31. Oak and Ash Says:

    So, in Toronto, keeping men out of anything–including women’s underwear and homeless shelters–is a human rights violation, while, elsewhere in Ontario, creating a special class just for boys at a public library is perfectly legit because they need it more:

    The one bright spot is the girl who fought back and got the class opened to all children.

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